Second -- The Screen Printer I had do the contract messed up. The front screen print across the chest is not centered with the tag. It is offset by about an inch to an inch and a half. It throws the whole design off in the front. It really bothers me.



Any comments or help is appreciated!!

I am not a screen printer and I only do a small amount of vinyl designs T-shirts for people, so take my comments for what they are worth.

I found that the tags are often sewn quite off center. I try and center my shirts with the collar rather than the tag so when it is worn it will look straight. If you center the design on the tag they might look OK at first glance but very crooked when worn. Try one of those on and see if it doesn't look better.

 

Absolutely. The exact placement of tags is not a concern to the mills. They (usually) do not provide specs for the placement, let alone a tolerance. Believe me, @horsepower, you most definitely do not want designs centered based on the tags.

For that matter, we are talking about lower to mid rung shirts here. It's not uncommon for the collars to be off-center with this tier of shirts.

 

Just wondering....did you take these issues to the printer to see if they can resolve? If not, you should probably start there.

 

Not yet. I picked them up on Friday late, so I have to wait until tomorrow.

 

Joe, my customers have reported quite a bit of shrinkage with Anvil and Jerzees preshrunk, not so much with Gildan preshrunk. I'd take the other issues up with the printer.

 

Thanks...I should have done a bit more re-search on the shrinkage problems. The fault lies with me on that 100 %.

Do you think I should switch to a 50/50?? These are "Fishing" and "Surfing" themed shirts. Do you think they would be too hot??

 

not all businesses are familiar with the concept of quality control. as mentioned, shirts sometimes look better when worn. still, that doesn't detract from the shrinkage.

i'm not trying to put any of the blame on you, horse, but did you research the product beyond the seller's claims?

ordering your shirts from china is hardly ensuring quality of prints or garment. if you still use the same brand shirt, why would you expect a different result regardless of what screenprinter you ordered it from? if cost was a factor, why didn't you just order from china in the first place? why didn't you inspect the merchandise before leaving their shop? sounds as if you just learned a lot of expensive lessons. take heart in the fact that those lessons will serve you well later on.

you said it yourself when you said you need to find a better quality shirt and better printer. personally, i'd return the bad product to the printer and tell him you want your money back as these shirts are unsellable. if he refuses, tell him as politely as you can that he gives you no choice but to take him to small claims. if he's unphased by that, actually take him to small claims.

 

I am the seller. I brought the issues up when I picked the shirts up on Friday. I'll try and resolve the problems on Monday. They are a big company here in Houston (I almost went to work for them when I left Bomark!)

I would not buy the same brand in China or elsewhere. This was just our first run to see the logos, get it out into the market, and take pics with a model for advertisement purposes.

 

You chose the shirt without doing your own QC prior to getting them printed? Did you provide both goods and seps? Did you call out PMS colors or just brown? Where there mock up's with actual placement measurements? 70 designs at 144 ea. I don't imagine China is going to jump thru hoops trying to get your work today. Until you have 100K per design and your having the garments manufactured to your specs your kind of stuck doing it here so pick a garment that passes the shrinking, call out PMS on the seps. Make the time to be at the printer so you can approve placement and color ways while they are being printed. Right now your business is a Baby and you have to nurture it from all aspects of it, this includes getting the prints to look the way you want them. If your expecting to be able to give someone a concept of what you want and have it come out exactly how you expect, well that's not going to happen until you can have someone be very involved with all the issues I mention above. That will be your job until you grow and you create these positions later on, for now you have to do this or you will repeat this mistake. It's always someone else's fault but I'm sure you did everything right and the printer did not follow all the directions or specs. After seeing what you paid, those jobs didn't even pay the cost of setup and machine down time so I would have to say you got off cheap and the printer lost both a potential return customer and on costs. That is unless you had someone working out of their home where they might have made a buck from you but hardly worth it.

 

I know those number are not staggering and China would not come looking for us! It was just a first run to get the logo going and get pricing. I do have over 70 designs that we are going to get done at about 1000 per run.

I provided the art work for the back of the shirts and the sleeve. They charged me an Art charge for the front of the shirts. I did not do a PMS number with them, but I did give them a reference on anther shirt. I was way off. The proof they provided looks good on color and placement. We will see what they say tomorrow.

I guess, I have no one to blame but them! Just kidding...I take some responsibility in all of this too.

 

I don't think those prices are bad at all. Anvil longsleeves are in the $4 range and you had 3 different locations printed for $7.88. I wouldn't do it for less than that price, on an auto no less. As for screen charges, they are a cost of business. There is a lot that goes into screens: the cost of screen itself, emulsion isn't cheap, chemicals required for reclaiming, film for output, as well as labor cost for employees. Rent, utilities and equipment (upkeep) isn't free either. I often tell customers starting a clothing line to start with the final retail price that they can get for the item and work back to get the unit cost in the area they'd like it to be. If you can only sell you item for $15 then you may need to do without a sleeve print to get your profit where you like, or increase the size of the order placed to bring your unit cost down. If you want your shirts in someones store they are going to expect to double their money as well, so that may also bring your profit down a bit. Clothing lines aren't easy to start, but don't get discouraged.

 

I have worked on your side as well a while back, so I know that you all need to make money as well. The cost is not my main concern, it was the printing being offset being the major concern. Screens charges I expected to pay.

I emailed / called the rep and have yet to here back. I'm going to call again today and see what they say. I'm not looking to get anything for "Free", maybe just a credit of some sort. I obviously cant sell these, with my BRAND on them with the printing messed up.

 

Sorry you had a bad experience. In future I would offer the following advice:

- ALWAYS provide Pantone numbers for every color except black and white
- OVERCOMMUNICATE what you want with your printer, the more specific you are, the happier they can make you
- 100% COTTON will always shrink more than 50/50s and be hotter and sweatier in the heat. 50/50 is the way to go.

Finally I'd advise you against looking overseas to do production, especially if there is a language barrier. I and my clients all do business overseas from time to time for cost savings, but if quality is important to you, you're really stacking the chips against yourself going overseas. Find a local printer, be sure they know what your expectations are of them, and make sure they have the right expectations of you...you are not a softball team that's just looking to slap a logo on there, and if they're the right printer, they'll understand that, OVERCOMMUNICATE.

 

Ohh, its ok. You live and learn that is for sure!! Pantone numbers for my next order .... FOR SURE!!

I have been looking overseas just to get a feel and the shirts plus printing are just a fraction cheaper. It is NOT worth it in my opinion either. Too many thing can go wrong and there is not a whole lot of leverage when they have a good portion of the $$ already.

Sooo, with all of this being said, if anyone can refer me to a GREAT SCREEN PRINTER that would be awesome! You can PM if you want. These forums are the best!

 

Where in Houston are you located?

 

Near Pearland.

 

wow, you have to watch out these days.

 

Another thing I always tell customers is that if you want to go online and find someone that will print cheaper - go right ahead! If you have a local printer you can get more hands on than with someone out of state or out of country. Especially with you having some print experience, you know how some print shops just slam the jobs out and quality control isn't there main concern. As Adam says overcommunicate, almost to the point of being a pain in the butt. That way your printer will know what you expect as far as quality and consistency. With contract work (which isn't my main thing) I try to tell my clients to come sign off on large orders, just so I don't get any calls like you are making right now. Good luck and keep us informed as to what happens..

 

Here is the front print for those of you interested.


Joseph

 

Here is the front print for those of you interested.


Joseph

I see ATS and a stripe, is there more to the graphic? I can see right away that the stripe isnt skewed correctly with the A. That also looks like a Heather tee which should have a percentage of poly and not shrink as much as 100% cotton.

 

Damn, that is way off center. That is what they call brown? Printers over here in LA, So Cal can use the work if the locals are giving you a problem. Good luck but man this country could use the work, don't send it out.

 

Is the "T" supposed to be centered??? If so, that is waaay off and I would hope the printer would re-run the job. The only question I have from not being able to see the whole front in the picture is, is the artwork symetrical, meaning is that bar on the left repeated on the right??? If so, this is bad. If it isn't repeated, meaning there is only the stripe to the left, and the ATS, and nothing to the right, the printer may have been anchoring off the end of the stripe or centering the overall design, if the "t" wasn't specified. Hopefully they will make things right.

 

Correct - The line is the same on both sides with "ATS" in the center of the logo and the shirt. The "T" is suppose to be centered on the shirt...underneath the collar.

I told you all it was BAD!!!

 

Also if the line on the right is shorter than the line on the left, then the printer may have taken the whole image and simply found the center and went with that. You're right though - it doesn't look good. It looks orange! Prints like that should be slam dunked. This is going to sound bad, but you don't even need a 'great screen printer' to do that shirt - you should be upset (not trying to add fuel to the fire) and the printer should re-do that - on his dime no less. Like Pablo said there are a lot of SoCal printers that could help you out. Another thing about Overseas - what is the timeframe and shipping/customs cost?

 

Lines are the same on both sides.

The color looks a lot like Burnt Orange or Texas Orange.

 

Hi,

All this problems you will face until you get your T-Shirts dyed, printed and processed with a professional printer who has all the in-house equipments to bleach, dye, compact, finishing and processing in addition to printing.

There is a process called compacting and this is also called 0-0 finish, which means there will be no shrinkage and no bleeding of dyes and color/inks.

 

I work for a huge silkscreen company the biggest joke is the lil ol blind ladies in - china mexico malaysia etc... where these jerseys are outsourced left their glasses at home when sewing them.
I sure wouldn't go overseas for anything like that.
At least 1-3 out of every huge order we have to do gets junked in the misprint box because of shirt problems

Actually what you paid for printing with that many locations is cheaper then what we charge !

 

Whats going on with the S? Is it supposed to be distressed?

 

Yes. It is suppose to look like that.

 

UPDATE --

I still have not heard back from the screen printer as of yet!! I have called and emailed numerous times this past week with no response.

I deal with one of their field offices, so I'm hoping she was on vacation or something. I'm going to give her until Wednesday until I drive over there.

I don't like being a jack-*** over these type of things because (one would hope) they will do the right thing. I'll let you know!


Joseph

 

oh geez here I was trying to defend your printer but that looks pretty horrible.

 

Updated...

I finally called the screenprinter Monday 8/1 instead of waiting for a callback. The owner (who I know personally) was out of town. I asked for the next person in charge, well he is out as well. I finally get the third person in charge.

I explain my whole situation to her....from the emailing without responses, to the calls without call backs, to the color of 1 design being totally the wrong color and the front print off centered (on both designs). She apologized and told me that should not have happened and they would rectify the problem. Keep in mind I'm not upset at all. She told me they would replace all the shirts and reprint them (I purchased 290 pieces and they did the contract screen print). I go one to tell her, I dont want them to be out anymore money. Just give me a credit and I'll order more shirts at a later date. I had already given away probably a 1/3 of them.

After going back and forth with her and not getting anywhere at all, they decided to give me $711.45 back out of the $1340.45 I was charged. They were still charging me for the printing on the shirts, even though I cant sell them. I FINALLY agreed to that instead of getting to the point of actually getting upset...which I'm not. I told them this would be the final transaction with them and I would not use them or ever recommend them to anyone else.

Am I wrong in this situation?? I did not want them to be out anymore more money than the giving me 90% of a credit and I would let them reprint them at a later date at full price.

 

Updated...

I finally called the screenprinter Monday 8/1 instead of waiting for a callback. The owner (who I know personally) was out of town. I asked for the next person in charge, well he is out as well. I finally get the third person in charge.

I explain my whole situation to her....from the emailing without responses, to the calls without call backs, to the color of 1 design being totally the wrong color and the front print off centered (on both designs). She apologized and told me that should not have happened and they would rectify the problem. Keep in mind I'm not upset at all. She told me they would replace all the shirts and reprint them (I purchased 290 pieces and they did the contract screen print). I go one to tell her, I dont want them to be out anymore money. Just give me a credit and I'll order more shirts at a later date. I had already given away probably a 1/3 of them.

After going back and forth with her and not getting anywhere at all, they decided to give me $711.45 back out of the $1340.45 I was charged. They were still charging me for the printing on the shirts, even though I cant sell them. I FINALLY agreed to that instead of getting to the point of actually getting upset...which I'm not. I told them this would be the final transaction with them and I would not use them or ever recommend them to anyone else.

Am I wrong in this situation?? I did not want them to be out anymore more money than the giving me 90% of a credit and I would let them reprint them at a later date at full price.

Wow... i give you credit for being so level headed. I don't think that screenprint company is trying to be mean. I just think that their company is inept... Maybe the owner will get involved when he gets back from vacation. Good luck

 

Print them yourself.

 

I wish I could. That is not part of my business model and I don't have the resources and or facility.

I know there are good ones out there somewhere!

 

IMO , 90% credit & keeping the shirts is alot ( If i understand it .. That would be paying $134 for what you got ... 46 cents per shirt ??? ) . " IF " you can use the shirts , a compromise that allows that company to offset the actual costs would be much more fair . I do think you have the right to a full refund/exchange . giving 1/3 of them out says they are acceptable & also complicates the deal as you can't return those . Giving you back the amount makes the shirts @ $2.16 ? That sounds fair especially if you don't want them to be out money as you said .

 

The shirts I'm giving out..people are like "These are free?". I tell them the print is off in the front. When they see it, they understand.

I'm losing $2,000! I can't charge our price to make a profit. Honestly there are about 23 shirts that are ok, I sold those to family at my cost.

It is a tough situation!

 

dunno, when we (refering to my wife and i's trophy shop) make a mistake we fix it fast and free and apologize profusely. then again, we try to avoid $1340 mistakes. but, really, what are they actually out if they re-do the job? they'll just not make any money re-doing in, maybe lose a little bit, but, hey, they screwed up, after all, and when small businesses screw up they pay the price.

i'm not grasping what their issue is. i don't know what kind of profit they made, but if you deduct the profit from the cost of the shirts and labour, they shouldn't take *too* much of a loss, no? it would be one thing if they had only screwed up a little bit, wherein they may be some negotiating room, but it seems they botched the entire order.

my advice, and someone feel free to debate this if you'd like as i'm always open to different viewpoints, would be to re-do the job, take a little loss if you have to, and keep a customer. i don't think i've ever lost a customer by promptly correcting my mistake.

 

I'm not saying I'm right in this situation, but I would make things right as well and try and keep a customer. But I'm partial to the situation. [media]http://www.t-shirtforums.com/images/icons/icon7.gif[/media]

 

Unless I am misreading your post IMO wanting to keep the merchandise plus receive a 90% refund is an unreasonable request.

The fact that you have already used 1/3 of them (regardless if you chose to charge for them or not) I think what they offered seems very fair. They could have insisted that you must return them for a refund as their only offer.

 

The thing that I don't understand is I bought the shirts, which means I own them. They messed up the print on 90% of the shirts. Why would you "insist" I return my shirts to them for a refund that I bought?? Just asking, I just want to understand. I don't know if I'm missing something.

Lets say you purchase 144 shirts and I printed them and messed up all but 14. Even though you took your shirts you owned, I insisted you brink back your shirts (which I keep) before I'll give you a refund for the printing. You would do that?

 

Please anyone that responds, I'm not trying to be a smart-a** when I respond, I just find it interesting how people would handle this. Some I'll agree with and some I won't.

 

You did not come across negative to me . The 2nd part is how you came across to me