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Discussion Starter #1
Hello guys.

I'm having serous problem with printing wet on wet on my 5 color Anatol horizon. When I'm printing multicolor jobs with white under base, the colored inks are being picked up from the white. Basically when I'm printing for example a red and blue design with white underbase, the second color (red) is being picked up in some places by the blue color screen and red in the design is full of spots showing the underbase.

I'm using 156 mesh for ma underbase and 230 for the top colors.

I'm flashing white with the q-runner flash (the one that slides under the pallet so you don't lose a print head)

The off - contact is about 1/16 for colors and 1/8 for white (I've tried raising it but it didn't helped).

I use Manukian Argon plastisol inks (This ink isn't popular in the US but in Europe it's a standard for high end printing companies so I don't thinks it's the ink problem)

I use aluminum frames cause sadly newmans wont fit my little press.

I hope I have clearly described my problem (my English sucks).

Any feedback appreciated.
 

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If you are printing 3 color 1 being your underbase.. Put underbase on print head # 1.. flash dryer print head 2 and your other 2 colors on print heads 4 and 5 that should be enough cool down.
 

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If you dont have room for a cool down station try setting up a cooling fan. He is right. Your underbase is still too hot when you try to screen the necxt color on top of it. Your flash may be dwelling too long...longer than necessary or set just way too hot. The other choice would be to switch to a underbase white with a faster flashing period or lower flashing temperature. There are plenty of good ones out there. Best of luck.
 

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There is a quick fix to this problem if in fact it is an underlay cool down problem... This isn't always the best solution BUT it does work very very well. Get yourself a spray can of silicone.. In fact, M&R sells a silicone spray machine for exactly this type of situation.. This isn't very economical on a long run but on a relatively short run, have someone stand right between the underlay after it is flashed and quick spray each underlay printed shirt with that silicone spray just before it goes under the next screen.. I do caution you though, there have been a few times i have had to make an emergency run to the hardware store to pick up a can of silicone spray for this purpose... some silicone sprays will leave a nasty slick residue which winds up ultimately ruining the print.. the kind that works dries real quickly but eliminates your "snap off" problem under the rest of the screens.
 

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oh yeah.. forgot to say this also.. another suggestion is to put your underlay on a 195 mesh. Less ink deposit means less flash time which means print won't be as hot and tacky for the next colors... for this method i would use the fan suggestion from the other post as well..
 

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Yes again just to reinterate what the other guys say, your underbase is still to hot and tacky after the flash. There are other brands of ink we use in the UK that have a very low to zero after tack, either leave a cool down space or try using an M&R cool mist solution. Also try increasing underbase white mesh to 90T (225 usa) if the design allows, this will obviously put down less ink and flash quicker with less heat exposure.
 

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An old trick that usually works really well is to get some silicon spray. You can spray a rag and wipe the underside of the screens after your flash and that should help cut down the tack issue. Just keep an eye on the screens because depending on the size of the run you may need to re-apply from time to time.
 

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This problem is not easily answered. When we print with an underbase, we thin our underbase by at least 10%, sometimes 20%. We are currently running an order of 15,000 shirts with an underbase thinned 20% and 5 colors after. We aren't having any problems with the following inks lifting. We thin down most of our inks, this keeps the build up to a minimum and the shirt have a much better feel. Good luck!
 

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Huge believer in the shurloc ez frames, we have about 65 of them and they are all above 30 newtons and have stayed there. They are the next best thing to newmans.

One more thing about your ink, it doesn't matter if your ink is a super premium, expensive ink. We've used many inks that were $80-100 a gallon and if they aren't formulated to print wet on wet, then you'll have serious issues. QCM XOLB line of inks are awesome, but not for automatic wet on wet printing. They'll build up as badly as a cheap, over plasticized knock-off brand of ink. Same goes for Union and Wilflex, they offer inks specially formulated for WOW printing.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Thanks a lot guys! I'm going to start experimenting with your suggestions this week and see how it goes.

One more question - it's better for the underbase to have more or less tack?

I will also try to thin my inks to the manufacturers recommended limit.

I will definitely check out the schur-loc (and meantime my current aluminum will go for re meshing).

Thank you guys once again!
 

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Have you ever considered where your wet on wet and underbase white plastisols are manufactured? And how far they have to ship to you? And under what sort of temperatures they will be sujected to? Plastisols are heat set inks meaning they are affected by extreme cold and extreme heat in the can before you open it. Just like good restaurants today try to purchase locally groun fresh produce, you might consider the same when you settle on an ink brand. The withe underbase might be thick, sticky and stringy for you because it was shipped 3,000 miles on a hot truck, while printers 100 miles from the manufacturer are enjoying great results. The same is true of waterbase emulsion. If frozen it is ruined. Ever have emulsion problems in the winter? Food for thought. No substitue for freshly made ink at the right viscosity and tack level.
 
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