[9th ave printing]

So we are loving the Image armor for shirts. TSF has been helpful to tune in the correct amount. Now we are trying on Black hoodies and also denim and have a tough time with the pretreatment box. The attached pics are the hoodie after 1 wash where the pretreatment box actually got worse. Why would it be more obvious after the wash?
Need some advise on the quantity of Image armor for fleece hoodie.....and denim? We are using the Viper 1 and Image Armor for Dark.....for shirt we use 3 turns open, but for hoodie we used 2 passes of 1 turn open. What are others using? Drying pretreatment with Hotronix heat press 330 degrees for 2 presses of 30 seconds each at pressure set at 3 with Teflon cover sheet.
Which Image Armor would you use on denim....Light or Dark?
Of course, we are under some tight timelines for this contract. The snowmobile event is in 10 days so we need to zero in on that pretreat "sweet spot" for hoodies and denim.

 

[twistinthewick]

I think the teflon sheet might be your problem. I use craft paper for my pretreating and curing. http://neoflexprinter.com/silicon-craft-paper-3.html

 

[treefox2118]

What's the fabric content of the hoodie? 80/20?

 

[23spiderman]

that is weird; i don't think i've ever seen the box get worse after washing. what brand of hoodie are you using?

more often than not, the pretreat box is a result of too much pretreat. back off until the box goes away. or you could try misting the edges of your box area with distilled water prior to spraying the pretreat. this should help to fade out the pretreat box.

 

[allamerican-aeoon]

Hard heat press pressure. Fleece is thicker than shirts. So lift up heat panel(in case using same set up). This is why I don't like air heat press which cannot adjust heights. Do not need pressure to cure ink. Ink drys in bel dryer.
Cut off edge of sponge(bottom) round all the around will reduce line.
Dark PT will work better. Too much is more possibility by picture.
Let's dig into it.
Cheers! Inks are on me always.

 

[9th ave printing]

The hoodies are Fruit of the Loom 50/50. We are using Image Armor for Dark. We did use lots of pretreat so we can dial it down but hoped to learn from those that have more experience with Image Armor. Anyone used IA dark on hoodies? Do you double amount compared to tshirts? Does the hoodie need to be wet with pretreat, like tshirts?
Any experience with IA on denim? Do you use AI light or dark on light denim?

 

[23spiderman]

My guess would be the poly fibers melting just a bit and causing the pretreat to shine.

I really like the Hanes Print-pro hoodies. Some are 80/20, and some have a 100% cotton face. Alternative an Canvas are two other guys brands, but may be costlier.

 

[jmcgurren]

Are you printing on light or dark denim? If you are using white ink you will need dark IA pretreat. The light is for cmyk ink only. Is that pretreat box you are getting shiny looking or is it just becoming faded? If it is getting worse after the wash I am thinking it is becoming faded by the heat press a bit as then after washing the material is fading more which makes it more prevalant. I have experienced this with tultex hoodies which print great but seem to shrink in the wash a little and fade from the heat press a bit. If this is the case then there is not much u can do aside from pick a different brand hoodie.

 

[23spiderman]

the IA for light shirts can hold white ink. i haven't tested it yet, but i know that on some lighter shades where you may want white highlights, but don't need the underbase, you can just send the color layer and print your job in one pass (with white highlights). but it is also formulated to hold the white underbase as well; but to be used on lighter shades of garments.

 

[jmcgurren]

Thanks I didn't know that I was assuming it was cmyk only for the light pretreat same as DuPont.

 

[Csipromo]

Did less pretreat fix the problem? Or maybe silicone instead of Teflon paper.. Anyway we always use jerzees 996 or 4997 for screen printing and I believe they are 50/50 on most. Has anyone had any luck printing on these? If so, would you mind sharing the secret formula? I'll be testing once I install the neo later next week. Thanks guys!

 

[Stitch-Up]

I'm afraid I haven't read the whole thread so excuse me if I'm off course!

Are you absolutely sure this background isn't in the artwork? I've had that happen to me and discovered the background in the artwork was to blame.

 

[jmcgurren]

Kraft paper.. kraft paper.. kraft paper. No need for anything else aside from maybe a teflon cover on your upper platen for extra protection or lower platen for easy threadability.

 

[JGCMelissa]

We're currently working on a black hoodie job as well, and it looks like you are using the same techniques as we are; IA for dark, Viper One, silicon paper, etc. and we don't seem to have that pt box (however I am currently washing one to test just in case). The only difference is we are using 75/25 Gildan hoodies, and only 1 pass of 1 turn open (30g) due to the absorbency. We also use a wooster brush to flatten the fibers.

 

[jmcgurren]

Wow 1 turn open for hoodies? Is this what it takes for a good print? Just wondering havent printed hoodies with IA yet. Sounds like I'm gunna use a whole lot of pretreat on a hoodie production run.

 

[9th ave printing]

Today is the day to figure out the magic formula. Thanx for your feedback. We will try all suggestions and report back. First trial--less pretreat.
Stay tuned.

 

[JGCMelissa]

Wow 1 turn open for hoodies? Is this what it takes for a good print? Just wondering havent printed hoodies with IA yet. Sounds like I'm gunna use a whole lot of pretreat on a hoodie production run.

We tried using less, the image suffered. The only thing I can think of is because the material's so thick, it has to go all the way through to hold the ink. Believe me, if I could have gotten away with using less IA, I would have.

 

[JGCMelissa]

Well, the wash test on ours came out fine. Upon looking at it, I think I am more inclined to think it has something to do with the poly content of the hoodies. My company also makes patches, and for those I use poly threads and fabrics, and use the heat press to "seal" the stitching. The "box" has the same shine that the patches do after they get pressed. Maybe try Peter's suggestion of less pressure, or hovering the press to dry without press, or even a lower temp setting on the press. Poly fibers at too high of pressure/temperature will slightly melt and look shiny like that.

 

[Teez310]

For darks I hover for the first 20 secs to reduce the PT Box. For IA it needs to be heat set for sure but can definitely hover a bit. Almost maybe using more pressure than needed.. I always hover around 3-4 on my pressure scale.

By the way at 2 presses of 1 turn thats around 50 grams! Most Ive used for IA is 25 grams.

 

[oc2dHK]

I PT Anvil 75/25 charcoal and received a big brownish square from the Viper 1 at 2 turns (19g). Also had cracking and pealing of print after washing two times with Tide pods. I had the same washing problems on Jerzee 50/50 sweats. They had the same PT setting. I air dry all PT.

So after reading the thread it seems I am using tooooo much PT. Doe's anyone have a better amount?