T-Shirt Forums banner
1 - 20 of 20 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
87 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I was curious if those who have any experience with the Thai table press in which the platen has the pin at the top and bottom of the platen.
The screen has a plate with an open (u) shape at one end and a hole on the end of the screen.

The pins and registration plates are difficult to locate here in America so I was think of an alternative to get the same effect.

I am curious if anyone would know if this idea would work.

Using "L" and "T" brackets I have two ideas

# 1- simply use the L bracket(inverted) at the top and bottom of the platen and the T bracket placed at the top/bottom of the screen and you simply match up the screen against the L bracket with the T bracket.....seems you should get no movement left to right, I dont know if you would get any movement up and down.

#2- very similar to #1 except using 4 L brackets-2 at the top 2 at the bottom.

Taking the L bracket and inverting both to create a channel where the T bracket can sit both top and bottom.

I will attach images of the parts and a very rough sketch of the idea.

Any feedback would be helpful.
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,651 Posts
Back in late 2015 or early 2016, I experimented with two DIY approaches to a line table press. One used adjustable "tuners" on the frames (machine screws with two nuts to jamb/lock them) and one with magnetic registration (my own idea).

There are various ways to achieve the desired registration, but the underlying principles are the same. 1) Three points of contact between the screen and the press. 2a) A means on the screen to adjust engagement with those points of contact to dial-in registration of multi-color prints. Or 2b) A registration jig for the art and screens that is accurate enough to produce good results with the art in question.

For the magnetic approach, I took the path of 2b, which would work well enough for the art I typically do--but perhaps not accurate enough for CMYK process printing.

Regardless, my sales where going through the roof, so I needed a better press now. So I gave up on my experiments and bought a traditional rotary press.

I encourage you to do some experimentation and testing. There are advantages to this sort of press, including space and expense. But it will take some messing about on your part to test the practical implications of various design and hardware choices. For example, adjusting hardware hanging off your screens might not be so compatible with a vacuum-top exposure unit. Have to think through the whole process--and actually do the whole process to find those things you didn't foresee.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
87 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I understand about parts on the screen, I initially was looking at a press sold by silkscreennow called the Blue Diamond it identical in many ways to the press being sold by Fraqtals.

The screen has a knob attachment that I foresee as an issue for an exposure unit that closes either with vacuum or a lid.

I have been all over trying to find the setup that's best for me both in cost and space as I am limited in space and to some degree budget plus I am starting as a hobbies hoping I can make this more a side job at the least.

I feel I have fallen victim to paralysis by analysis I'm just stuck right now in terms of direction.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,378 Posts
The Thai system may look simple but it is actually very good.
Once in, and if the fittings are tight, the screen cannot move in any direction.

In addition to that, you can use it to pre-register the screens on the exposure unit.
This way there is no need for having registration functionality on the printing table.

Here is an easy to do variation... and all you need to make it is a few tools most people already have.
Basically an angle grinder, a hammer, and a drill.
The only thing that needs a bit of precision is the bottom registration pin, but that's easy to do.
No precision is needed for the other parts, and they don't have to be identical.
Rectangle Gas Font Computer monitor accessory Output device


For the registration pin, you can modify a regular bolt with a long shank. Like this...
Product Font Engineering Auto part Cylinder

Fix the registration pin on the table first, and then use it to mount the registration plate in the correct position for every screen.
This pin has to be tight, so it is better to drill a slightly smaller hole, and then use sandpaper to slowly expand it until the pin fits.
Here is a homemade tool for doing this, hopefully it makes sense. Use 60 or 80 grit sandpaper for fast results.
Wood Cylinder Office supplies Gas Metal
(photo credit).
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
87 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 · (Edited)
The Thai system may look simple but it is actually very good.
Once in, and if the fittings are tight, the screen cannot move in any direction.

In addition to that, you can use it to pre-register the screens on the exposure unit.
This way there is no need for having registration functionality on the printing table.

Here is an easy to do variation... and all you need to make it is a few tools most people already have.
Basically an angle grinder, a hammer, and a drill.
The only thing that needs a bit of precision is the bottom registration pin, but that's easy to do.
No precision is needed for the other parts, and they don't have to be identical.
View attachment 276740

For the registration pin, you can modify a regular bolt with a long shank. Like this...
View attachment 276741
Fix the registration pin on the table first, and then use it to mount the registration plate in the correct position for every screen.
This pin has to be tight, so it is better to drill a slightly smaller hole, and then use sandpaper to slowly expand it until the pin fits.
Here is a homemade tool for doing this, hopefully it makes sense. Use 60 or 80 grit sandpaper for fast results.
View attachment 276742 (photo credit).
How much of the bolt are you removing I understand the top is removed, the part in blue Im confused on is the part you sand down? or are you wrapping the sand paper around the bolt and sanding inside the drilled hole till the bolt is firmly inside the hole(sorry I am confused)

Is it possible to use some type of anchor that is dropped into the wood and the bolt is the tighten down through the anchor?

The brackets seem easy enough angle cut a " V " which the top bolt will catch the top plate on the screen and press a hole for the bolt pin at the bottom and both top and bottom brackets are screwed into the screen frame(would you recommend anchors in the screen hole or not necessary.

some clarity on the bolt fabrication would be helpful.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,378 Posts
How much of the bolt are you removing I understand the top is removed, the part in blue Im confused on is the part you sand down?
Just the head, and giving it a convex cone shape make it a bit easier to use.
The blue part is two nuts and the mounting plate.

or are you wrapping the sand paper around the bolt and sanding inside the drilled hole till the bolt is firmly inside the hole(sorry I am confused)
The sanding tool is basically a homemade honing tool, for slowly increasing the size of the registration hole after drilling it.
You can make it with a piece of wood, as in the photo, or by taping the sandpaper on anything that fits in a drill chuck.
Here is another example (source).
Wood Wood stain Flooring Hardwood Tool


Is it possible to use some type of anchor that is dropped into the wood and the bolt is the tighten down through the anchor?
Yes, this is possible.
You can buy threaded inserts for wood, or you can drill a hole and epoxy the bolt in it.
Using the bolt+mounting plate makes it easier to modify or replace later. You can of course use a block of wood as a mounting plate.

The brackets seem easy enough angle cut a " V " which the top bolt will catch the top plate on the screen and press a hole for the bolt pin at the bottom and both top and bottom brackets are screwed into the screen frame(would you recommend anchors in the screen hole or not necessary.
I don't know what you mean by this, but there are many possible variations.
You could for example make the top registration plate identical to the bottom, but inserting and lifting the screen will be difficult, especially you want tight registration.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
87 Posts
Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Just the head, and giving it a convex cone shape make it a bit easier to use.
The blue part is two nuts and the mounting plate.


The sanding tool is basically a homemade honing tool, for slowly increasing the size of the registration hole after drilling it.
You can make it with a piece of wood, as in the photo, or by taping the sandpaper on anything that fits in a drill chuck.
Here is another example (source).
View attachment 276747


Yes, this is possible.
You can buy threaded inserts for wood, or you can drill a hole and epoxy the bolt in it.
Using the bolt+mounting plate makes it easier to modify or replace later. You can of course use a block of wood as a mounting plate.


I don't know what you mean by this, but there are many possible variations.
You could for example make the top registration plate identical to the bottom, but inserting and lifting the screen will be difficult, especially you want tight registration.
Yes, this is possible.- this would remove the need to use the sand paper?

I don't know what you mean by this, but there are many possible variations.- I was meaning to say the top part of you diagram shows a " V " angle cut with the bottom part of the diagram showing a hole, I am thinking that with the top angle cut it could be a "V" or "U" shape cut and with the bottom simple drill a " O " for the bottom reg. pin?

What type material and size I have been looking at my local HD seems they sell aluminum flat bars in very small sizes

I saw on howtoscreenprint instagram page he had a diagram of the parts looked as if the plates where at most 2.5" H and 2.5 W that seems a bit small.

If you have any different understanding please pass along and the type material.

Thanks for all your help and information it has been a great deal of help to me!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,378 Posts
this would remove the need to use the sand paper?
We are not on the same page...
I'm talking about the mounting plate for the registration pin. Not the registration plate on the screen
If you want tight registration, honing the hole ans sanding the shank of the bolt smooth is the only way.
This is the only part where a bit of precision is needed.

I am thinking that with the top angle cut it could be a "V" or "U" shape cut
Sure... but the V shape is better for ensuring there is no left-right play.
This is obviously optimized for push-print strokes, which is what I personally prefer.

What type material and size I have been looking at my local HD seems they sell aluminum flat bars in very small sizes
I'd use mild steel because it lasts longer and it's also easier to cut with an angle grinder.
2" wide and 1/8 thick flat bar will work in this configuration.
Rectangle Wood Font Parallel Insect


If you are gong to use wood screens, drill the screw holes first to avoid splitting.

I modified the "flying bird" to two parts as well, making easier to make with a hammer.
No precision or perfect contact is needed. The idea is to jam it in the V of the screen, so it cannot move left-right.

If you make more than one set, drill the holes in the flat bar before cutting the individual pieces.
It's just esier to drill this way.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
87 Posts
Discussion Starter · #9 ·
We are not on the same page...
I'm talking about the mounting plate for the registration pin. Not the registration plate on the screen
If you want tight registration, honing the hole ans sanding the shank of the bolt smooth is the only way.
This is the only part where a bit of precision is needed.

Sure... but the V shape is better for ensuring there is no left-right play.
This is obviously optimized for push-print strokes, which is what I personally prefer.


I'd use mild steel because it lasts longer and it's also easier to cut with an angle grinder.
2" wide and 1/8 thick flat bar will work in this configuration.
View attachment 276749

If you are gong to use wood screens, drill the screw holes first to avoid splitting.

I modified the "flying bird" to two parts as well, making easier to make with a hammer.
No precision or perfect contact is needed. The idea is to jam it in the V of the screen, so it cannot move left-right.

If you make more than one set, drill the holes in the flat bar before cutting the individual pieces.
It's just esier to drill this way.
We are not on the same page...
I'm talking about the mounting plate for the registration pin. Not the registration plate on the screen
If you want tight registration, honing the hole ans sanding the shank of the bolt smooth is the only way.
This is the only part where a bit of precision is needed.

sorry for not following as I am understanding this when you say mounting plate- this is the registration pin attached to the platen or platen arm correct?
As for the sanding that is to smooth over the top part of the pin( after cutting it you want a smooth rounded top )
Am I following you correctly at this point?

When you mentioned using a hammer to to create the "flying hammer" how is that done, I assumed you would need to cut the angle with a saw of some sort.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,378 Posts
when you say mounting plate- this is the registration pin attached to the platen or platen arm correct?
Correct... the mounting plate for the pin.

As for the sanding that is to smooth over the top part of the pin( after cutting it you want a smooth rounded top )
Nope... The top convex cone part is irrelevant.
I'm talking about the shank of the bolt. Sanding it smooth makes pulling the screen out easier.
Oiling it will help as well.

I also recommend using high carbon (12.9 grade) bolts for these pins.
These will last longer as the mild steel registration plates will not be able to score them as easy.
Don't use zinc plated bolts.

When you mentioned using a hammer to to create the "flying hammer" how is that done, I assumed you would need to cut the angle with a saw of some sort.
Just hammer it like shown below. 1/8 is not very thick and will bent fairly easy.
Rectangle Font Parallel Logo Poster

Eyball the first one, and then use it as a reference for the rest of them.
They don't have to be precise.


I assumed you would need to cut the angle with a saw of some sort.
Cutting the angle is not necessary, but you can use the grinder to do so if you want.
The fitment does not have to be exact. All you are trying to do with these is stopping the side to side movement of the screen.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
87 Posts
Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Correct... the mounting plate for the pin.


Nope... The top convex cone part is irrelevant.
I'm talking about the shank of the bolt. Sanding it smooth makes pulling the screen out easier.
Oiling it will help as well.

I also recommend using high carbon (12.9 grade) bolts for these pins.
These will last longer as the mild steel registration plates will not be able to score them as easy.
Don't use zinc plated bolts.


Just hammer it like shown below. 1/8 is not very thick and will bent fairly easy.
View attachment 276752
Eyball the first one, and then use it as a reference for the rest of them.
They don't have to be precise.



Cutting the angle is not necessary, but you can use the grinder to do so if you want.
The fitment does not have to be exact. All you are trying to do with these is stopping the side to side movement of the screen.

I think I understand sand down the threads on the pin as in the attached image?

Also using a brass wood insert nut would work as the registration pin holder?
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,378 Posts
I think I understand sand down the threads on the pin as in the attached image?
Nope... the other part.
You will realize what I mean once you try it.
The threads are not a problem because they can go all the way through the wood, so they will be out of the way.

Also using a brass wood insert nut would work as the registration pin holder?
These will do but you still have to use a nut to stop the bot from moving
Again, you will realize what I mean once you try it.
Just make sure the threads of the insert and the bolt match if you buy online. There is a lot of variety.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,378 Posts
As I look at HD site it states a plain steel 2"X36" 1/8 flat bar is $25
Aluminium will do, but will not last as long as steel.
This is a steel job.

HD type of stores have crazy prices here too.
My local supplier is selling these for around £5 per meter (which is around $5.50) and a meter is more than a yard.

If you are going to make a lot of them, ask around and find a real metal shop.
Otherwise, 36" will be enough to make 5-6 screens (2 x 3" pieces/screen)... so around $5 per screen.

For the other part, you don't need 2" width. One inch wide 1/16 flat bar is more than enough, and will also be easier to bend.
Also you will not need more than 10" inches of it per station.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
87 Posts
Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Aluminium will do, but will not last as long as steel.
This is a steel job.

HD type of stores have crazy prices here too.
My local supplier is selling these for around £5 per meter (which is around $5.50) and a meter is more than a yard.

If you are going to make a lot of them, ask around and find a real metal shop.
Otherwise, 36" will be enough to make 5-6 screens (2 x 3" pieces/screen)... so around $5 per screen.

For the other part, you don't need 2" width. One inch wide 1/16 flat bar is more than enough, and will also be easier to bend.
Also you will not need more than 10" inches of it per station.
You lost me here, are you still referring to the screen parts( top or bottom)?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,378 Posts
You lost me here, are you still referring to the screen parts( top or bottom)?
2" wide flat bar for the screen parts.
Dividing it in 3 inch lengths will do, so you need 6" of flat bar per screen.

1" wide 1/16 flat bar for the "flying bird" part.
This will be easier to bend, and strong enough for this part.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
87 Posts
Discussion Starter · #19 · (Edited)
This particular variation has perfect registration.
If you calibrate the exposure registration to the table, there is no need for anything else.
would something like this registration guide work- with either screw(in red) or wood furring strips(blue) as a frame guide work?
Or would it be best to duplicate the screen registration on the guide and have the reg pins on the guide(green)?

Also curious if you think these 2 parts will work for the screen registration with the angle strut fastened in a V shape.(v1)
Would I need to open the hole on the T bracket more or only find a bolt that fits- to work as the reg pin?(T2)
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,378 Posts
would something like this registration guide work- with either screw(in red) or wood furring strips(blue) as a frame guide work?
There are many ways to register a screen, but not all of them are equally easy or equally good.
I think the one in your photo is this...
Rectangle Triangle Symmetry Font Parallel

A much more basic registration system obviously, but if you are careful not to move the screen while printing, this will work as well.
A similar system is used when printing on paper, but for registering the paper instead of the screen.
 
1 - 20 of 20 Posts
Top