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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I'm putting together an estimate for a friend who wants to sell his artwork on shirts, on a website he will design and monitor. We print, he ships to the customer. How do I determine a fair amount to charge for our labor? Our costs will be $8.00, he'll sell for $20. How should we split the $12 profit??? Any thoughts?

It is his artwork. So would a 40/60 split be fair? We get 40% of the profit on top of all our costs (shirt, ink, pre-treat).

Marie
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
We're still new to this DTG market. It seems like we are calculating costs differently for each customer. Some are non-profits and don't have a lot to spare, some are more established and have paid full price ($10-15) to screen printers.

So this is another new situation for us. We don't really have a dollar amount "to keep the doors open" as you said, because we are still so young.

That's why I thought if I could breakdown the costs vs. profits it might make more sense for him. He's probably going to do the math anyway, and want to know what my costs are.
 

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You need this customer.

Not to profit financially, but to cut your teeth & learn your costs.

Take the job and let him know that you're still pricing.

Then, keep track of every minute and every ml you use. Adjust your pricing as you discover new ways to save or new reasons you charged too little.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Thanks for all your opinions. To answer your questions:

--$8 is the cost of the shirt (AmApp), shipping, ink (detailed art), pretreat
--They are doing the marketing, sales and website. We are just printing.
--Once the website is up, he'll deal with advertising. And they'll try to sell to specialty stores.
--We do "need this customer". They have a lot of connections with places that he's done illustration work for brochures, playbills and posters. And his customers might want t-shirts.

We ended up proposing splitting the profit 40us/60them. Will talk over the proposal with them on Monday.

Thank you for all your advice. We'll see what happens.:)
 

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So this is another new situation for us. We don't really have a dollar amount "to keep the doors open" as you said, because we are still so young.
you've received some solid advice here, but i'll add to Brian's point regarding knowing your cost. this is a MUST, and in my opinion, is one of the biggest mistakes that new (and old) shops make, including myself. they don't know what they must bring in to "keep the doors open". so go ahead and move forward with your proposal, and learn from it; but also spend some time figuring out what all your costs really are.
 

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royster13: that's a truth. I didn't get into garment printing initially until a local shop closed their doors and I acquired their equipment for $0. $30,000 worth of literally brand new equipment, some of it never saw ink. Can't beat that. And even at $0 cost, we barely made it our first year. It was touch and go. For DTG, I just rolled my own "play" money into it, and I bought the cheapest printer on the market. That one made money from day one, BECAUSE I had customers from SP. Otherwise, I doubt I'd have cashflowed on that machine for well over a year, if that.

The thing is, this industry has too many customers and too few (local) shops. If you build a market, and service your customers, and stay in contact with your customers, you'll make a profit. Calling old customers regularly to check in is the key factor in staying in business.

Building a cool website is not.
 

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How can anyone not know what they need to keep the doors open? It only takes a few minutes and a calculator, or a pencil and some scrap paper if you are really frugal.

Here is a quick example based on a one person shop. Your numbers will be different, but the concept is universal.

Static Costs:

Rent/Lease/Mortgage - $1500
Utilities/Phones/I4.3 we I srnet - $600
Insurance -$200
Office/Cleaning/Bathroom Supplies - $100
Equipment Lease - $1100

Total - $3500

Non Static Costs - these will vary drastically depending on the business, how long it has been open, the model it uses, it's location etc.....but you should know what they are for your situation, just plug in the numbers.

Marketing - this could be a zillion numbers. It could be a certain dollar figure of every shirt you sell, it could be a % of gross or net sales, it could be a set static amount (bad idea btw), or something else. For this example let's assume a new shop with little to no sales. Because of this they budgeted a monthly marketing allowance of $1200 for the first year, after that they will move to a % based program.

Business Expansion/Emergency Repair Fund- how much do you want to set aside for new equipment to grow the shop? Or in an emergency fund to fix equipment failures? Let's assume one new piece of equipment for either expansion, or just to keep up with technology every 30 months. This can also be done on % or on a static number. Once again, new business, so we will use a static amount of $500.

Community Involvement - this is an important item often overlooked. Local kids sports teams or band sponsorship, yearbook ads, etc..... $50 per month to start.

Marketing - $1200
Expansion/Emergency - $500
Local Community Involvement - $50

Total - $1750

Grand Total - $5250

Notice I have not included material cost. That will be calculated into individual job qoutes. It will vary greatly from shop to shop. Some shops will have much less waste, and errors in the printing process than others. You just need to know yourself.

Now let's discuss the number of actual production hours you have in a month. Every month has 4.3 weeks. Assuming 5 work days at 10 hours per day, that is roughly 215 work hours per month. Notice I wrote work, not production hours. Let's trim it down to a realistic level.

10 hours per work day -

30 minutes opening shop and preparing equipment for the work day.
30 minutes closing shop and performing daily maintenance.

This may seem like too much time, but if you calculate all the little things that must be attended to on equipment during the day,(mixing pretreatment, chabging bobbins, threading needles, shaking ink, etc...)I think you will find it accurate.

60 minutes marketing - this is new marketing, not answering the phone, following up on qoutes, etc....New marketing only - website, print, social media, chamber lunches, etc....

60 minutes dealing with walk ins, phone calls (business and personal), follow up emails, etc....

120 minutes for lunches, smoke/coffee/soda/tea breaks, bathroom breaks, etc.....

Half your work day is gone with ZERO production. That leaves 5 hours a day, or 110 per month.

Sooooooo, what do we need to charge?

Take our $5250 and divide by 110 and we get $47.72 per hour just to stay open. That includes zero dollars for our salary. Add even a modest $22.28 per hour and you get $70.00 per hour.

Let's assume the fictional order is for 60 single sided digitaly printed black shirts. Let's assume we can do 20 per hour. We need to charge at least $3.50 per shirt, over and above costs. And this assumes no waste.

Order Quote

$2.50 - blank shirt
$2.50 - ink & pretreatment
$3.50 - labor

$8.50 minimum. .......

I know several of you will give me grief over only five hours of production per day, and I am sure many of you exceed that, but I am sticking with it for a start up one person operation who wishes to grow quickly.

My costs may be much higher than some of you, but I think they represent a good starting point for working out of a commercial location.

Zilla
 

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How can anyone not know what they need to keep the doors open? It only takes a few minutes and a calculator, or a pencil and some scrap paper if you are really frugal.

Here is a quick example based on a one person shop. Your numbers will be different, but the concept is universal.

Static Costs:

Rent/Lease/Mortgage - $1500
Utilities/Phones/I4.3 we I srnet - $600
Insurance -$200
Office/Cleaning/Bathroom Supplies - $100
Equipment Lease - $1100

Total - $3500

Non Static Costs - these will vary drastically depending on the business, how long it has been open, the model it uses, it's location etc.....but you should know what they are for your situation, just plug in the numbers.

Marketing - this could be a zillion numbers. It could be a certain dollar figure of every shirt you sell, it could be a % of gross or net sales, it could be a set static amount (bad idea btw), or something else. For this example let's assume a new shop with little to no sales. Because of this they budgeted a monthly marketing allowance of $1200 for the first year, after that they will move to a % based program.

Business Expansion/Emergency Repair Fund- how much do you want to set aside for new equipment to grow the shop? Or in an emergency fund to fix equipment failures? Let's assume one new piece of equipment for either expansion, or just to keep up with technology every 30 months. This can also be done on % or on a static number. Once again, new business, so we will use a static amount of $500.

Community Involvement - this is an important item often overlooked. Local kids sports teams or band sponsorship, yearbook ads, etc..... $50 per month to start.

Marketing - $1200
Expansion/Emergency - $500
Local Community Involvement - $50

Total - $1750

Grand Total - $5250

Notice I have not included material cost. That will be calculated into individual job qoutes. It will vary greatly from shop to shop. Some shops will have much less waste, and errors in the printing process than others. You just need to know yourself.

Now let's discuss the number of actual production hours you have in a month. Every month has 4.3 weeks. Assuming 5 work days at 10 hours per day, that is roughly 215 work hours per month. Notice I wrote work, not production hours. Let's trim it down to a realistic level.

10 hours per work day -

30 minutes opening shop and preparing equipment for the work day.
30 minutes closing shop and performing daily maintenance.

This may seem like too much time, but if you calculate all the little things that must be attended to on equipment during the day,(mixing pretreatment, chabging bobbins, threading needles, shaking ink, etc...)I think you will find it accurate.

60 minutes marketing - this is new marketing, not answering the phone, following up on qoutes, etc....New marketing only - website, print, social media, chamber lunches, etc....

60 minutes dealing with walk ins, phone calls (business and personal), follow up emails, etc....

120 minutes for lunches, smoke/coffee/soda/tea breaks, bathroom breaks, etc.....

Half your work day is gone with ZERO production. That leaves 5 hours a day, or 110 per month.

Sooooooo, what do we need to charge?

Take our $5250 and divide by 110 and we get $47.72 per hour just to stay open. That includes zero dollars for our salary. Add even a modest $22.28 per hour and you get $70.00 per hour.

Let's assume the fictional order is for 60 single sided digitaly printed black shirts. Let's assume we can do 20 per hour. We need to charge at least $3.50 per shirt, over and above costs. And this assumes no waste.

Order Quote

$2.50 - blank shirt
$2.50 - ink & pretreatment
$3.50 - labor

$8.50 minimum. .......

I know several of you will give me grief over only five hours of production per day, and I am sure many of you exceed that, but I am sticking with it for a start up one person operation who wishes to grow quickly.

My costs may be much higher than some of you, but I think they represent a good starting point for working out of a commercial location.

Zilla
This is so accurate it's incredible.
 

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We're still new to this DTG market. It seems like we are calculating costs differently for each customer. Some are non-profits and don't have a lot to spare, some are more established and have paid full price ($10-15) to screen printers.

So this is another new situation for us. We don't really have a dollar amount "to keep the doors open" as you said, because we are still so young.

That's why I thought if I could breakdown the costs vs. profits it might make more sense for him. He's probably going to do the math anyway, and want to know what my costs are.
Hi Marie,

Just my opinion but your costs are your concern and not that of the artist that you commission. If there are any numbers discussed, it would only be the dollar amounts that he would make on each shirt versus knowing exactly what your costs are. That like opening your checkbook for them to examine...this gives them too much information and could be used by the artist to have an upper hand to renegotiate terms that are not favorable to you. Just a thought.
 
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