[JohnR]

I posted a thread about getting started and attending INDY show, and now am ready to purchase some items.

Printer: I anticpate intermittent use of a printer, so am seriously considering getting the Epson C88 and using cartridges instead of bulk ink to start. I want to avoid clogging issues and figure I can always upgrade to a bigger & better printer later, when the usage increases. Is this crazy?

Heat Press: I don't want to shell out $1,200 for a press, though I really like the DK20S, when I can spend $275 on a JP12 and "learn the business." My concern here is that the small one will give me fits. I saw a recent post on here where someone is trying to get the right pressure and their press just doesn't have the settings needed - sounds pretty frustrating! I intend to do sublimation on plaques for starters and and don't want to waste money on a dinky little press, unless, of course, it will do the job...

Any thoughts would be GREATLY appreciated.
Thanks
John

 

[CUSTOM UK]

Hi John. First off I think that the Epson C88 model is now discontinued, so you may possibly be looking at another Epson model. Check out the cost of the sublimation inks before you make any purchases though, as a set of these will probably cost you several times the cost of the printer itself. Clogging comes from lack of use, rather than the type of ink supply system.

Dinky little presses do have their uses. They are ok if space if limited and their low wattage, means they don't cost much to run. Not much good for tees, but ok for plaques etc.

Hope this helps.

 

[stuffnthingz]

Before you decide, I think you should investigate what sublimation on plaques requires as far as accuracy of temp/pressure. I own one of those JP12s (paid $100 for a used one on Craigslist) and amazingly enough it rocks for JPSS and Duracotton HT which are both known to be highly sensitive to pressure. On the other hand it is very, very bad at pressing Pro World transfers, who'dve thunk that! Oh and it is the best for setting rhinestones (what I first bought it for).

 

[mrdavid]

JP12 was my first press and I bid every thing with it and never had any problems. And sold it for what I paid for it. so don't let any one say you cant do it when you can! The only thing is it is small and you will have to make more then one press if you do bigger transfers.

 

[COEDS]

I have done sublimation and you truly want at least a 15x15 size press. I encourage you to ask people who do sublimation for more opinions. I think a swing is better for doing tiles with. Pressing tiles with a clam type press is a little trickier because the tiles can shift. I wish you the best of luck. ... JB

 

[deChez]

I have the JP14 press. The JP12 is really a hobby grade press, and I think the JP14 is probably a "borderline" hobby press.

I've been using it for about 18 months now, and recently had to replace a part. Although, I think it was due to the fact that I had "firm" pressure too "firm". The service department at GeoKnight was very helpful, by the way.

Point is, there is nothing wrong with buying the JP12, just don't expect too much of it, and you'll be fine.

I could not imagine trying to line up an 8 1/2 by 11 transfer on the smaller JP12. I think the time you would save by going up just one "notch" to the JP14 would be well worth the $.

 

[COEDS]

John, I would suggest you check out a used name brand press on Ebay or Graigslist. I needed a second press and Hix 15x15 on Ebay for $265 including shipping. If you have the time, you can find a good deal. .... JB

 

[JohnR]

Wow! You guys are awesome with your replies. So, now a few questions about them.

Dreamglass: You said clogging comes with lack of use, but the Sawgrass representative at the INDY show last week told me that cartridges don't dry out and clog - unlike the bags of dye... is this true, or am I mistaken?

Stuffnthingz: You said "investigate what sublimation on plaques requires." I guess that's what I'm trying to determine. Will the time, heat, and pressure be measureable enough with a small press like the JP12 to do simple sublimation plaques???

DeChez: You said "I could not imagine trying to line up an 8 1/2 x 11 transfer on a smaller JP12." Are you referring to sublimation on plaques or tshirts? I really don't intend to do tshirts in the beginning. Please clarify if you could.

COEDS: Yes, I've started looking for a used heat press! Thanks for the tip.

Million Thanks to you ALL!!!
John

 

[CUSTOM UK]

Hi. I think you'll find lots of folks on here that have had major clogging issues wirh Sawgrass inks.

Sadly reps on commission are more interested in pushing product, than giving out accurate advice.

It is the print heads themselves that clog, not the ink supply method.

You'll find lots of balanced independent advice on these forums, from people that aren't trying to sell you anything.

Hope this helps.

 

[JohnR]

Okaaaaaaaaay. Now what. I guess I thought I had my printing needs (at least for starting out) figured out. You know, get a small printer, don't buy a bunch of ink, learn how it all works, and THEN upgrade.

So, can I use a small epson printer and differnent BRAND of ink cartidges instead? I am trying to avoid shelling out $600-$800 for ink bags, which very well might dry out on me over the next year, while I am printing very intermittently. Any advice...

Thanks
John

 

[CUSTOM UK]

The legal standpoint, is that Sawgrass has somehow managed to secure exclusive rights to sublimation ink, for small format printers.

Some might suggest that the ridulously high price of sublimation inks, is what is stopping the industry from expanding.

Unless you are using your printer at least a couple of times per week, you may well encounter clogging issues. Constant head cleans will only waste more of your expensive ink.

 

[JohnR]

So it sounds like there is NO choice, Sawgrass is it. And, it sounds as though I'll have to print a couple times a week. However, are you saying the cartridges WILL, IN FACT, clog just as often as the bulk inks will? Why would he say to me, straight up, that they won't? Especially if there is no other alternative to their product...?

John

 

[deChez]

DeChez: You said "I could not imagine trying to line up an 8 1/2 x 11 transfer on a smaller JP12." Are you referring to sublimation on plaques or tshirts? I really don't intend to do tshirts in the beginning. Please clarify if you could.

John

I was referring to t-shirts. I don't do sub, or plaques, so I really have no frame of reference for that.

I totally understand your intention here, and I think you're smart to stay within a small budget to test the waters. And I also think you're on target when you say you "don't want to waste money on a dinky little press, unless, of course, it will do the job..."

The JP12 might very well do the job for the purpose you intend right now. And the JP14 might allow you to easier test/add methods and products within that small budget.

 

[CUSTOM UK]

It is the the print heads that clog John. Whether the ink is in cartridges, or via a bulk feeder, that will make no difference at all. If you are only using the printer occasionally, you would be better with cartridges anyway, purely on the fact that the much larger volume of ink in a bulk system can end up going past its 'use by' date.

It is the people that are using the products day in day out, that will give you the most accurate advice. The only reason I can think of why the rep would suggest that to you, is either through lack of knowledge, or the fact that cartridges seem a cheaper option to a newcomer when compared to a bulk system. This is purely on the fact that cartridges have much less ink in them, than a bulk system does, so the cost appears smaller.

If you type Sawgrass into the search box on this forum, you will get a measure of the type of business that they are.

Hope this helps.

 

[stuffnthingz]

My JP12 has a temp gauge and a handy little timer on it, so the only question is pressure, which I cannot answer since my model is old enough that it doesn't have any pressure setting. Perhaps someone with a newer JP12 can answer the pressure question.

 

[COEDS]

John, I have done Dye Sub and used Sawgrass ink. I used a Epson printer, I had clogging issues and print profile issues. I will be honest Dye Sub has a big learning curve to overcome. I don't want to discourage you at all,I just want to inform you. I know many people that do quite well with this form of printing. ... JB

 

[mrdavid]

Here is link where you can get the printer and sub ink to do what you want.


eBay Seller: ksw0209: Business Industrial items on eBay.com

 

[COEDS]

Here is link where you can get the printer and sub ink to do what you want.


eBay Seller: ksw0209: Business Industrial items on eBay.com

I just followed the link provided and I must say the only thing that disturbed me is what was not said. If I was going to bid on this,I would ask if the ink is Sawgrass ink and if they have the print profile. I would be skeptical about buying a printer with non sawgrass ink. I'm not sure of the legal issues around having non sawgrass ink. The copyright infringement issue of off brand ink scares me. I have had issues involving copyright infringement and it's not a place I want to see anyone else at. .... JB

 

[CUSTOM UK]

I was given a couple of large format Epson printers. These are legally allowed to use ink other than Sawgrass and don't have the problems with clogging.

Colour correction profiles are widely available for free download off the Internet. I found some of the ones used for specialist photography inks, give the best results.

 

[JohnR]

Boy, you guys just don't quit! So, I think I will seriously consider the JP14, since I will be in a sort of "experimental" stage and don't want the dinky JP12 to limit my capabilities too much.

Last year I set up the woodshop to make the plaques. I found out while buying 2nd hand power tools that you don't want to skimp unless it's absolutely necessary. A high quality Porter Cable router was well worth the extra 35% over the cheap Craftsman. With this in mind, I don't want to attempt some off-brand type of ink while I'm suppossed to be learning. Not to mention that, if I get my printer, ink, heat press, sublimatables from a reputable vendor like Conde, then I will also have tech support - something I don't think I want to go without while starting up. I just thought that I could get the heat press 2nd hand since it isn't a very complicated machine (I think...).

I believe I will go with the basic printer, with Sawgrass ink cartridges, the JP14, and will get an accucutter to cut the metal.

Oh yeah, the metal. What I intend to do is sublimate onto metal and put the metal onto the wooden plaques I make in my shop. Is the learning curve harder or easier when sublimating on metal...?

Thanks
John