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Took a while to finally load in… I’m on cable. I think it might have been the music file that was taking a bit?

I would love to have my site cranking the Dead live at Boston Garden on 10/1/94… but was advised against it. Might want to offer a way to turn the music off? I was told that if someone visits my site and doesn’t care for my taste in music, they’ll probably leave. Just a thought.

Besides that… I cruised around w/ no problems! How’s MySpace pulling for you?
 

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I think the shirts are priced too low. It loaded super fast on my computer. I have broadband. The music was about 20 seconds delayed, that happens on my site also. I think the music is fine as long as you can turn it off. The shirts are cool. Some are mildly shocking.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
hey thanks for your post....i know we're getting traffic and im thinkin a little of it is from myspace we're pretty much trying to get things rolling on a regional level so i think its been a good tool thus far....we've only been on for a few weeks
 

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Gotta have an option to turn off the music. I think you'll lose a lot of people just because of that. Myself, if I hit a site with audio, I usually exit without even bothering to see if there's an on/off option. Also, some of the text needs proofing. Image quality seems kinda poor. Looks like you have some template stuff still hanging around (ie., homepage: "define your main Index page copy here").
 

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I also believe that the shirts are priced too low. I also don't care too much for the music. But other than that it looks like a good start. good luck
 

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Hello,
I enjoyed your site very much. You have applied the K.I.S.S. principle which helps keep people interested in the site. You already heard about the music. I am new to the business so keep that in mind when I tell you that a lot of the postings that I have read regarding parodies of company enblems walk the thin line as far as the legality of it goes. An example would be the 7 inches shirt. I like the idea just be careful with those for there are a lot of forum members that have gotten letters from the companies legal team. Besides that, great job and god luck.
 

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"Define your main Index page copy here." "LOL SORRY WE'RE STILL TRYING TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO ADD MULTIPLE IMAGES TO OUR PRODUCTS"

Less than professional text, stolen designs (i.e. ripped off from T-Shirt Hell), jagged thumbnail images... if I'm being honest I was extremely unimpressed. You've been running like that for weeks?

Navigation (the other thing you asked about) was fine.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
thanks for your input....and as for the tshirt hell comment they stole the "tom is my only friend shirt" from us.....understandably you probably saw it first there because at this point we're a no name site, but thats been on our site for well over a month and just popped up on theirs....so who steals from who.
 

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My main problem with the site would be the thumbnails being jaggity. Also your banner picture should be crystal clear. One of the girls in the group actually has that glowing eye syndrome from poor lighting. It just looks unprofessional. Navigation and links are fine though.

Oh and...The click here part. If your "here" is a link, it should be looking like it is. I never figured it out until I hover overed by it by accident. I thought click here meant the whole sentence to click.
 

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!!!!! Work in progress !!!!!
sorry for the unprofessionalism. <- is that a word? lol.

1. Working on the thumbnail issue.
2. Working on the Banner issue. The banner is only letting us upload a gif, trying to resolve this today and get a jpeg, or png in there.
3. Working on getting more product images up also.

PS. the HERE part is fixed, someone did some editing and didn't realize it was supposed to be in another color. oops, way to go Ben, lol.

Thanks for the comments keep em coming!!!

Now I get to rant for a bit. I have a comment on the tshirthell statement also. Everyone out here steals from everyone, I can pull up 10 sites and at least 4 of them will have the same idea for a shirt or nearly the same design. I think it is inevitable to have all original content because eventually someone is going to come along and take it change one or 2 things and call it their own, which by copywright law is ok, cause they have changed the design. As far as the shirt on tshirthell and on ours we had that up for nearly a month, then they have it now too, and which Ben has already said we are the newbie in the biz, and hell is the top dog, so they are obviously what everyone bases opinions, ideas, and what not on. Just my thoughts IMHO. Thanks.

Christopher
Co-Founder

www.TeasePlease.com
 

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TEASEPLEASEINC said:
Now I get to rant for a bit.
Oh... goody. *sigh*

I had refrained from saying anything to the earlier post because I figured enough had been said, but if you really want to pursue it...

TEASEPLEASEINC said:
Everyone out here steals from everyone, I can pull up 10 sites and at least 4 of them will have the same idea for a shirt or nearly the same design.
"So what if I murdered the guy, everyone else was doing it..."

Come on, just because it's small time doesn't mean that excuse suddenly makes any damn sense at all. And if by "on here" you mean these forums, while obviously there's some plagiarism there's surprisingly little, and amongst the regulars it's downright uncommon. What flies in the boondocks doesn't pass in civilised society.

TEASEPLEASEINC said:
I think it is inevitable to have all original content
Original content is not inevitable. If it were we wouldn't be having this conversation.

TEASEPLEASEINC said:
eventually someone is going to come along and take it change one or 2 things and call it their own, which by copywright law is ok, cause they have changed the design.
No actually, it's not.

Copyright law offers a lot more protection than that to copyrighted works. On the other hand something as short as a sentence cannot be copyrighted.

I suspect it's actually a bit of a grey area in this case - you can't copyright a sentence or a word, so that other writers aren't restricted to having to write a novel that consists of the phrase "spelunking dishwasher" 40,000 times. Personally I'm not convinced a court wouldn't uphold copyright on a short unique phrase in the context of a t-shirt design though. I have no idea what the reality is though - anyone know if it's been tested? It's more the realm of trademark law, so it's complicated.

TEASEPLEASEINC said:
As far as the shirt on tshirthell and on ours we had that up for nearly a month, then they have it now too, and which Ben has already said we are the newbie in the biz, and hell is the top dog, so they are obviously what everyone bases opinions, ideas, and what not on.
First off, I simply don't believe that T-shirt Hell could even be aware of someone as tiny, new and consequently invisible as your store. The idea that they stole a shirt design from you is laughable. That pretty much leaves two options, 1) You're lying, and stole it from them, and 2) You're both referencing the same popular culture of the moment and independently came up with the same idea. The idea isn't sophisticated, so there's every reason to believe it's option two. I certainly wouldn't put it past T-shirt Hell to steal (I bet they've done it in the past and will do it again), but I think they'd need to see the idea first to steal it.

However I wasn't talking about the Tom shirt, but rather the "There are two people ... " shirt. I find it interesting that you both leapt to the defence of the wrong shirt.

While you may be able to get away with it legally, I don't feel it's within the spirit of the law, and I certainly don't feel it's moral. Sure some things are generic ("I'm with stupid") or so obvious no-one can claim ownership ("The only Bush I trust is my own"), but "There are two people f***ing on the back of my shirt" seems pretty specific to me.

I'm not saying you're necessarily breaking the law - I'm saying you stole it and as a customer I wouldn't like that.

I guess ultimately my point is that your designs seem largely derivative, so you're not a very attractive proposition to customers. You do have cheap prices, but other than that what are you offering that would make people buy from you instead of someone else? You're not the only one to be cheap, and you're certainly not the only one with those concepts on a tee. Your site is far from being the worst I've seen, but it's a long way off the best too. What's your angle? You don't need one to get some sales, but it really helps to get a significant amount.
 

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The trademark/copyright issue is interesting. I'm in the process of trademarking a phrase that is a fairly unusual combination of words that has never shown up, to my knowledge, on an article of clothing or any other sort of good. My lawyer just received the report back from the trademark office, in which my application was politely denied, even though they acknowledged that the phrase was not in use as far as they were concerned. I think it boils down to the fact that, even with trademarks, it isn't easy to lock up phrases/words and the trademark office certainly isn't interested in making it easy.

However, there is one decent way to lock up a phrase and that's through consistent and historical use. Case in point: those twits at Marvel & DC Comics putting in for a joint trademark on the word "super-hero." Maybe if some of us are still selling shirts for a couple decades, we can start trademarking some of our phrases...
 

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Sadly any notions I have about the legal protection offered to text based t-shirt designs are probably just wishful thinking. It's probably one of the things in Law's ample 'Too Hard Basket'.
 

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I'm in the process of trademarking a phrase that is a fairly unusual combination of words that has never shown up, to my knowledge, on an article of clothing or any other sort of good. My lawyer just received the report back from the trademark office, in which my application was politely denied, even though they acknowledged that the phrase was not in use as far as they were concerned
The thing you have to remember about trademarks is that it is designed to protect a *brand*. Not a cool/unique phrase or idea. But to specifically protect a brand name.

Sometimes the line gets blurred because the brand is also a cool/unique phrase (or is pitched to the trademark office as such), but in the end, you'll just need to prove to the USPTO that your cool unique phrase will be (or already is) the core of your brand.
 

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Yeah, that's basically what my lawyer said as well - though in other words. If the phrase can be established as a brand, then the trademark office will accept it. However, that means putting in some time and creating a track record for the brand. Very doable.
 

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teaseplease said:
IF YOU COULD GIVE US SOME FEED BACK AS TO HOW OUR SITE LOOKS AND IF ITS EASY TO NAVIGATE.....ETC AND WHAT DO YOU GUYS THINK ABOUT THE SHIRTS.http://WWW.teaseplease.com
First, it loaded fine. I did not hear any music at all but my browser blocks a lot of annoying things. On the surface the site looks good.

I read several post that stated your prices where too low. Why? The real question is are you going to make a porfit. Who cares what others think about your pricing as long as you can sell the shirts and make a profit.

I personaly would not know if $12.00 is in line or not or if you are making a profit off of that price. I am a profesional screen-printer and only do custom work, not pre-prints for us to sell on line one ore two shirts at a time. A normal job for us will be anywhere from $200.00 to $15,000.00 per order. Thats a whole different ball game than selling one shirt at a time on the web.

You shirts are all simple one or two color spot prints. Depending on how many you are buying at a time, the $12.00 selling price could be netting you a healthy profit and thats what counts.

Anyway, good luck with you venture. I hope it works out well for you.
 

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Preston said:
I read several post that stated your prices where too low. Why? The real question is are you going to make a porfit. Who cares what others think about your pricing as long as you can sell the shirts and make a profit.
I can tell you why it is important not to price your products too low…perceived value. Normally, you don’t want potential customers to think that your products are “cheap”. If that’s the image you WANT to convey, that’s fine, but you must also take into account that many people don’t want to buy “cheap” things. In their mind they equate “low price” (cheap) with poor quality. It may not necessarily be the case, but it does not matter if a potential customer perceives it as such, and therefore does not purchase.



I think a lot of coming up with price points is knowing your market. What amounts are “normal”? How much are they accustomed to spending on particular items?



So yes, you are correct in saying that the real point is: “are you going to make a profit”, but what must be taken into account is “Am I losing profits by pricing my products too low?” because of customer’s perception of the value and quality of my products. If it is too low the potential customer may be thinking “I like the shirt, but I don’t want to spend my hard-earned money on a shirt that is going to shrink the first time I wash it. Or the letters/design will fall off.” Some people have no confidence in buying things that they think are very low-priced.


Preston said:
You shirts are all simple one or two color spot prints. Depending on how many you are buying at a time, the $12.00 selling price could be netting you a healthy profit and thats what counts.
This is true. The actual garment may be costing them next to nothing, and they could be netting a decent amount per shirt. But that’s not REALLY what counts, in my opinion. What really counts is “maximizing” profits. Because if you are not maximizing profits, then you are leaving money "on the table". And I can’t see how that’s any good at all. So the question should be “Have I priced my products so that I am getting the highest percentage possible of people that like my products to buy them?” The problem is you have people, like I said earlier, that wouldn’t buy a product if it were priced to low, AND you have people that won’t buy a product if it is priced too high. So coming up with correct price points is the only you are going to maximize your profits, which means maximizing your efforts. Which also means knowing your market. Have they done this? I don’t know enough about this particular market to know whether they have or not. But seeing a couple of people comment on a price being TOO LOW, could be an indication that they may want to re-think their pricing.



As for the design of the site…Grainy pics, jagged text. Doesn’t look professional. Like I said, I don’t know much about this particular market, but I can see how someone would look at the prices, combined with the issues of the site, and think “Cheap Stuff” and just leave. That’s my .02.
 

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Solmu said:
Oh... goody. *sigh*
I had refrained from saying anything to the earlier post because I figured enough had been said, but if you really want to pursue it....
My turn again for a rebuttal, for the misconception that was just posted in reply to my rant.

Solmu said:
"So what if I murdered the guy, everyone else was doing it..."
Come on, just because it's small time doesn't mean that excuse suddenly makes any damn sense at all. And if by "on here" you mean these forums, while obviously there's some plagiarism there's surprisingly little, and amongst the regulars it's downright uncommon. What flies in the boondocks doesn't pass in civilised society..
My statement has nothing to do with that comment you made about murdering someone cause everyone was doing it. That is just a cheap shot and you know it, everyone knows that just cause he does it and so does she doesn't make it ok for me to do it. So next time don't drag us down just cause you read into things too deep or can't understand what was being said. Why would I care if Joe said the same thing as Susie said in a post 3 weeks ago, who cares, we are talking about designs on shirts and phrases on shirts, I guess this commment you made just shows how much you really are in tune with this conversation in this thread. Glad to hear about the boondocks too, it made me think of what it would be like to be you to live there, sad...sad...sad...

Solmu said:
Original content is not inevitable. If it were we wouldn't be having this conversation.
I said I think I didn't say cold hard fact is you can't have original content, it was meant to be viewed as sooner or later someone comes in takes an idea, reverse engineers it or something like that, changes a few things, and calls it their own, and going to 10 different tshirt sites you will find duplicate designs, or somewhat similar designs on them, so I guess technically I could be wrong cause the orginal content is going to hold true cause I was the first guy to have a shirt with 2 snails and 5 caterpillers in a sex scene on it, and then the next guy takes it and changes one thing calls it his own and sells it I guess yeah the first one is original content, so I will say sorry I was wrong in that comment, sorry. Thanks for pointing that out to me.

Solmu said:
No actually, it's not.
Copyright law offers a lot more protection than that to copyrighted works. On the other hand something as short as a sentence cannot be copyrighted.
I suspect it's actually a bit of a grey area in this case - you can't copyright a sentence or a word, so that other writers aren't restricted to having to write a novel that consists of the phrase "spelunking dishwasher" 40,000 times. Personally I'm not convinced a court wouldn't uphold copyright on a short unique phrase in the context of a t-shirt design though. I have no idea what the reality is though - anyone know if it's been tested? It's more the realm of trademark law, so it's complicated.
True you can't copyright words or a phrase, but you can trademark it as long as it is the basis for your company and has pretty much everything to do with the name, but a novel with a spelunking dishwasher as the main character might have a pretty good future, you should think about pursuing that one, lol, just playing man, it was funny though.

Solmu said:
First off, I simply don't believe that T-shirt Hell could even be aware of someone as tiny, new and consequently invisible as your store. The idea that they stole a shirt design from you is laughable. That pretty much leaves two options, 1) You're lying, and stole it from them, and 2) You're both referencing the same popular culture of the moment and independently came up with the same idea. The idea isn't sophisticated, so there's every reason to believe it's option two. I certainly wouldn't put it past T-shirt Hell to steal (I bet they've done it in the past and will do it again), but I think they'd need to see the idea first to steal it.
However I wasn't talking about the Tom shirt, but rather the "There are two people ... " shirt. I find it interesting that you both leapt to the defence of the wrong shirt.
While you may be able to get away with it legally, I don't feel it's within the spirit of the law, and I certainly don't feel it's moral. Sure some things are generic ("I'm with stupid") or so obvious no-one can claim ownership ("The only Bush I trust is my own"), but "There are two people f***ing on the back of my shirt" seems pretty specific to me.
I'm not saying you're necessarily breaking the law - I'm saying you stole it and as a customer I wouldn't like that.
I guess ultimately my point is that your designs seem largely derivative, so you're not a very attractive proposition to customers. You do have cheap prices, but other than that what are you offering that would make people buy from you instead of someone else? You're not the only one to be cheap, and you're certainly not the only one with those concepts on a tee. Your site is far from being the worst I've seen, but it's a long way off the best too. What's your angle? You don't need one to get some sales, but it really helps to get a significant amount.
Yeah tshirthell prolly doesn't know who we are, and I really don't care who they are either. I don't visit tshirt sites to get ideas, or steal or reverse engineer ideas. However if you want me to I can, which it almost sounds like that is what you are accusing me of so since you want to put cart before the horse then fine, you just do that. I am not laughing either about them stealing an idea from us, yeah it was misworded as in they could very easily come up with the same idea as us, it is not prepostorous to think that, and it is def. possible. So I can agree with you on that one, coincidence, yes. Do they steal, oh I am sure they do, twist an idea around, call it their own why not, it is the american way. Take, take, take. lol.
I didn't even know they had a shirt like the one you are talking about "there are two people..." one. I had to go look and find it for myself. So thanks for telling us about another shirt Tshirthell stole from us.......lol...kidding. Coincidence, I think so again!!! Needless to say it is going to happen, and why sit here and bicker about it, everyone has an opinion, just as they have assholes! Who cares. But don't say we stole it and that is the truth according to you cause you have no idea now do you? Glad you wouldn't like that and neither would I as a customer, but until you can show me when and how, and that we stole it, which you prolly can't then don't make a comment like that.

Our designs are largely, ultimately, 100% our own, brand new, new site, many other designs on the way, and your just one Joe Schmoe with an opinion, which is fine, and I DO VERY MUCH SO appreciate your input. Just next time if you have all the negative to say or accusations send it in a PM to me, before we have to go through all this again. So thanks for all the negative input, and the one positive of we aren't the worst you have seen. Being new in the biz, getting the name out, and the hits and sales is yes the hardest part of getting going, which is why we are focusing on our area for now, and have branched off another company already just for shirts that are more of the everyday style. We have a good projection of where we want to be, and how to get there, it just takes time, and I am sure everyone of you can vouch for that comment. Well thanks for reading sorry if I offended anyone, I am just not going to sit here and take someone calling me a theif, or for that matter a liar. I hope others out there stand up for yourself also. Thanks again, and Happy Tuesday!!!!!

Christopher
Co-Founder
www.TeasePlease.com
 
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