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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi guys, I have a roland BN-20, only a few months old, I am having problems with the cutting. Every time when I print and cut, the right side(printer head rest side) is always a little off, while the left side looks fine. I calibrated sheet feeding and did the print and cut adjustment too, didn't fix the problem at all.

Does anyone know what caused it or had the same problem? Thanks in advance!
 

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Not too familiar with the bn-20, but if it's similar to my SP300 and still uses Versaworks, you should probably be doing the print->laminate->cut workflow.

Try using the "Crop Marks (Print and Cut Alignment)" option in Versaworks under Marks. This will print a set of four circles around your artwork and also include a rectangle at the start of the sheet. Set your printer to "Print Only" on "Print/Cut Options", feed it out a few inches, cut it, then reload and choose "Cut Only", it should then scan for the marks and cut. I find this to be a lot more precise on my cutpaths especially for larger pieces. You should still have a small bleed, but usually it cuts just about spot on.

The only time you would want to print and cut at the same time is for something where lamination isn't required, if you're not using lamination on sign vinyl, you're committing one of the sign industry's big sins and the sign police will be after you!!! There are plenty of items that just simply don't need lamination though, I like to run off gangs of address labels/folder labels, or "reorder" labels/made by labels and so on through my roland without lamination.

If you use the crop marks it should improve your accuracy quite a bit. I've heard various reasons as to why the printers won't cut on point, usually most people point to the fact that the vinyl gets heated to cure the solvent inks while it's printed and misshapes a bit, then doesn't have proper cooling time when it gets cut so it's a bit warped. Don't know what the actual truth is, but this should get you more accurate cuts I hope!
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Hi, thanks for your reply, I print indoor decals so no need to laminate. I tried to use crop marks before, it seemed to be a better option but I actually got worse cuts with the marks, not sure whats wrong with it.

I use windows 8, and I use my PC charges my Iphone too while printing. But during printing, if I unplug my phone, 90% of the chance the BN-20 will stop printing or cutting.

I am going to replace the cutting strip, I see some very small cuts on it, hopefully that will fix it.
 

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did replacing the strip fixed your promble i am looking to buy bn20 the thing is i live in south america and don't have tech support here so every
lil problem that show up weith this printer i would like to know
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Nope, that did not fix anything. I bought it from UScutters, they won't return my call, my local roland dealer sent one guy out, trying to say my blade holder was causing the problem, I got a brand new one from Roland, didn't fix anything. After 2 months, the machine is still not fixed. This is the last roland printer I am buying, can't even have it fixed when its still under warranty.

You should do more research before buying this machine, the media rolls are very limited, not many people selling 20" or below rolls. The media profiles are very limited too for this machine. Its better to buy a HP latex printer and a graphtec cutter instead of all in one machine like this. Not only you will print faster, you can have one machine printing and the other cutting at the same time, that's something you can't do with BN-20.
 

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Owning both an HP (L25500)/Graphtec FC8000 combo as well as a Roland (SP300V), I would disagree.

The HP is a pain in the *** to load media with. The instant curing on it is great, but have fun servicing the machine when warranty is expired, their "service kits" (OLAP sensor/etc) that go out every year and a half or so are exceptionally fun to replace. Believe I was quoted around $3000 to come and fix it for me, ordered the kit online for like $250 and did it myself, but wouldn't ever recommend it to a novice. Also, I got the lovely Onyx Postershop 10 with this setup and it only seems to print 25 mm crop marks, but yet my graphtec fc8000 only supports up to 20mm, which gives everything a nice great skew and border that isn't wanted, when I started doing the math, I eventually was like "why is everything like at least an eighth to a quarter of an inch off, wait a second, that's right around 5 millimeters". So instead I get to be blessed with adding crop marks manually in my artwork and jumping through a few hoops with Corel, Postershop, and my Graphtec driver, or I could pay an awesome $600+ (think that was what they quoted me) to upgrade Postershop and fix this "feature".

My Roland, haven't had any issue with it in the past 7 years other than the pump going out while it was still under warranty (I guess all sp300v's had bad pumps for the first few years). Easy to load media, although the curing time does kinda suck, especially since my floor isn't always the cleanest and wet solvent inks can pick up dirt, or if media folds on top of itself and it's wet, can damage the print. I've never had an issue with Versaworks aside from a few corrupt caches that needed to be deleted (I started clearing it about once a year). That being said, I still prefer to print and cut with my roland much more so than to mess with my HP/Graphtec setup.

If you're still covered by warranty, you should annoy the crap out of them til they get someone knowledgeable out there. I wouldn't try a local office, hit up corp and get them on the case. Roland's forums are generally filled with good roland techs, when I was wanting to do some thick acrylic cutting with my EGX engraver, I called up one of the techs that was on frequently posting on the forum and poked his brain. Their Blade holder excuse sounds completely bogus to me as well. Generally without reg marks, I get up to 1/16" of a possible skew, so I add a bleed, and I never print+cut anything past a 3 lineal feet to keep that as low as possible and add about 10 mins drying time before it cuts, everything else reg marks generally gets it fairly spot on. I don't know what the bn-20's warranty's like, but Roland came out within a week to my remote location (120 miles from an airport/city of size) when I had to have my pump replaced, and the dude seemed to be able to diagnose it very well beforehand and gave me a lot of helpful maintenance tips.

I do agree with you on the 20" being an awkward size and sourcing material for it will probably be very hard especially in a foreign country. Roland's trying to find new markets and make things more entry level without going the way of CriCut, the problem is the ambiguity it creates in the marketplace. Even my 30" printer was kind of hard to find proper printable media for when I first started using it, although I find most vendors now offer 30" printable media no problem. 54" was the norm back then, and sometimes I still kind of kick myself of going with the 30" instead of the 54", but it got us started anyway.

Anyway: TLDR, BN-20 is a new machine, may be hard to source materials for because of that. Set a budget first, then review your options next, if you're going into signage, size is always king and you WILL kick yourself for going too small out the gate. I don't agree that a print+cut separated solution is better than a roland print&cut, they both have their pros and cons.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Thank you for your input, we are talking about BN-20 not SP300V though. Let me just say this, I was trying to trade it in for a better machine at my local roland dealer, the second they found out I am trying to trade in a BN-20, they said they don't want it, that told me something when a roland dealer doesn't even want a roland BN-20. BN-20 is only good for very small businesses that dont have much orders. If you use white ink, it will take you 2-3hours to print and cut a single job(say 30" long of stickers).

I am not even worrying about warranty running out, I can't even get it fixed when its under warranty and I live in Houston, TX, not some place in the middle of nowhere. I talked to two Roland techs, eventually they just stopped replying to my emails or return my phone calls. When I called them again, I was told I need to contact my local dealer. When I call my local dealer, it always go to voice mail, I would be lucky if someone actually calls me back. When they finally sent someone out, the tech didn't want to change any parts, trying to tell me my blade holder is causing the misaligned cutting. But what does that have anything to do with not able to detect crop marks? When I told him the sensor for ink level is not working right, I got waste ink overflow when the utility saying its only 50% full, and for inks, sometimes it shows empty with the inks are actually full, or show they are full when they are actually empty. I was told it takes time to update the ink level. Really? When I told him one side always cuts deeper than the other side, I was told nothing wrong with the machine.

I guess i will be contacting Roland again, if they dont want to fix it they can buy this machine back. I don't know about who are those people on their forums saying nothing but good stuff, but I have a BN-20 and this is my experience. If I can get rid of this machine, I will try Mimaki or HP and graphtec combo.
 

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I haven't been to a sign show in about 3 years, last one I went to they were pushing the BN-20 pretty tough, having seminars and stuff at the Roland booths for it. Curious now if they're looking to dump the product though for support reasons, or if their customer support has just gone to the crapper in the past few years.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Roland printers have so many service calls in Houston Area is not even funny, I had to wait for 10 days for the local dealer to send someone out just to take a look, that guy actually came from Dallas, all the techs from Houston area were tied up to other service calls. They are hiring more techs that tells me its not going to get better soon. Think about it, I guess I can understand why the local dealer can not answer every single service call.
 

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Dwarfsh,

I've been dealing with USCutter for years and anytime I need help with my Graphtec equipment or media, I've just called 425.902.1302 and got help instantly or a call back from the department that handles my item? Everything I've read about that BN-20 has been great except for the speed. The cutter is the same as a GX-24 so it should be right on. I used to have one of those but sold it to get my 54" Graphtec 8000. Have you tried to reset it to its default settings?-
 

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Hello dwarfsh,

This is Roland Corporate Offices Technical Support. To avoid publishing your personal information in this forum, we ask that you email us directly at [email protected]. Please provide the following information in your email:

Your first and last name:
The printer serial number:
Your phone number:
The name of the dealer that sold you the BN-20:
The name of the person you've discussed these issues (at the dealer's location):

We will continue this conversation offline and provide you an ultimate solution.

Thanks and we look forward to your email.

Roland Technical Support
Roland DGA Corp.
Tel: 949-727-2100 Fax: 949-727-2112
rn
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Dwarfsh,

I've been dealing with USCutter for years and anytime I need help with my Graphtec equipment or media, I've just called 425.902.1302 and got help instantly or a call back from the department that handles my item? Everything I've read about that BN-20 has been great except for the speed. The cutter is the same as a GX-24 so it should be right on. I used to have one of those but sold it to get my 54" Graphtec 8000. Have you tried to reset it to its default settings?-
Yep, I have tried everything, did all the alignment adjustments, everything turned out fine but when I do the cutting, thats when problem starts. I reset everything to factory setting too, then did all the adjustments, but that didn't fix anything.

When I do a job that less than 15" long, the cuttings will be fine, but if I do a job thats longer than 15" long, that is when the problem starts.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Hello dwarfsh,

This is Roland Corporate Offices Technical Support. To avoid publishing your personal information in this forum, we ask that you email us directly at [email protected]. Please provide the following information in your email:

Your first and last name:
The printer serial number:
Your phone number:
The name of the dealer that sold you the BN-20:
The name of the person you've discussed these issues (at the dealer's location):

We will continue this conversation offline and provide you an ultimate solution.

Thanks and we look forward to your email.

Roland Technical Support
Roland DGA Corp.
Tel: 949-727-2100 Fax: 949-727-2112
rn
I have contacted you guys so many times I spoke to two different techs. I even sent emails with photos etc. Eventually they stopped replying without giving me any solution. When I called again and talked to the 3rd tech, she told me I need to contact my local dealer and ended the conversation.

I need someone to fix my problem not just listening to my story. So far that is what I got, they don't mind listening to what's wrong with my machine but they didn't do anything to fix it. I have explained so many times to different techs(not just from roland), its getting old.
 

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Hello dwarfsh,

We regret the difficulties you've experienced. We will do all we can to help rectify the issue for you, including contacting your dealer ASAP to discuss a plan of action.

We do not want any of your private information to be posted in this form, so please email the previously requested info to [email protected], and we'll get on it right away.

Thanks.

Roland Technical Support
Roland DGA Corp.
Tel: 949-727-2100 Fax: 949-727-2112
rn
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 · (Edited)
My roland case number is: CAS-174267-B7L9, opened on 2/24/2014. I am not sure how much details he put in there since he just stopped replying at some point. So here are the problems I have:

1.Sensors for ink levels are not working right, sometimes when the ink is nearly empty and the utility shows the ink is full, sometimes when the ink is nearly full and the utility shows its empty. I only use Roland inks and buys waste cartridge from Roland. I had a waste ink over flow when the utility said the waste cartridge was only 50% full. If a tech can help me clean up the bottom of the machine I would really appreciate it, since I can not really clean it without opening up the machine.

2. Machine can not detect crop marks. If I print and cut with crop marks, the machine will roll the media all the way back out of the machine when it tries to find the crop marks, then display an error message says can not detect crop marks. If I reload the media, the machine will find the crop marks, but the cuttings will be off anyways.

3. Right side of machine does not cut deep enough. For example, when I do a test cut with 42 pressure, it cuts fine on the right side, if I use 42 pressure to do a job on the same vinyl, right side will not be cut deep enough, while left side cuts fine. Replacing cutting strip, blade and blade holder didn't fix it.

4. Cutting on the right side is misaligned with or without crop marks. I use 20 inch wide rolls, If I do a job that is 20 inch wide, 12 inches long or below, the machine will cut fine, other than right side's cutting wont be deep enough. If I do a job that is 20 inch wide, longer than 12 inches or so, the cutting on the right side will be misaligned, while left side cuts ok. We have tried the alignments in the utility software so many times, reset to factory setting then adjust everything again, nothing fixed the problem.

5. The right side media clamp need to be changed again, its crooked. For whatever reason I am always having problems with that side.

6. The machine would stop printing, cutting for no reason. This maybe happens twice a month, when that happens, I had to restart the machine, redo the job again, otherwise print head would not go back, no error message neither. I know if I charge my cell phone on the same pc and unplug my phone will cause this, but it happens on its own too.

By the way, sending out a tech to look at it is not going to fix anything, my local dealer done that already, nothing fixed. I think parts need to be replaced at this point to fix the problems.
 

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Do not give up on Roland print/cut machines, maybe just the BN20 - I have heard of this problem from a user in Florida - there was an adjustment not at the user lever to correct. I can tell you that Roland will work with you. Unfortunately, it will require your patience just a little longer. I am sure you are being moved to the top of the queue.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 · (Edited)
The hard part is finding a tech who actually knows about BN-20. it looks like none of the techs who came to my place had a training on BN-20. First tech almost took the whole machine apart when changing a media clamp, then he had to call others to figure out how to do it, while I could have done it myself under 5 mins, I was told I was not allowed to do it myself since machine is still under warranty, they had to send someone out to do a professional job. The 2nd tech was going on and on about all the features in the software, I was going to tell him those features were actually disabled for BN-20 but that would be awkward.
 

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My roland case number is: CAS-174267-B7L9, opened on 2/24/2014. I am not sure how much details he put in there since he just stopped replying at some point. So here are the problems I have:

1.Sensors for ink levels are not working right, sometimes when the ink is nearly empty and the utility shows the ink is full, sometimes when the ink is nearly full and the utility shows its empty. I only use Roland inks and buys waste cartridge from Roland. I had a waste ink over flow when the utility said the waste cartridge was only 50% full. If a tech can help me clean up the bottom of the machine I would really appreciate it, since I can not really clean it without opening up the machine.

2. Machine can not detect crop marks. If I print and cut with crop marks, the machine will roll the media all the way back out of the machine when it tries to find the crop marks, then display an error message says can not detect crop marks. If I reload the media, the machine will find the crop marks, but the cuttings will be off anyways.

3. Right side of machine does not cut deep enough. For example, when I do a test cut with 42 pressure, it cuts fine on the right side, if I use 42 pressure to do a job on the same vinyl, right side will not be cut deep enough, while left side cuts fine. Replacing cutting strip, blade and blade holder didn't fix it.

4. Cutting on the right side is misaligned with or without crop marks. I use 20 inch wide rolls, If I do a job that is 20 inch wide, 12 inches long or below, the machine will cut fine, other than right side's cutting wont be deep enough. If I do a job that is 20 inch wide, longer than 12 inches or so, the cutting on the right side will be misaligned, while left side cuts ok. We have tried the alignments in the utility software so many times, reset to factory setting then adjust everything again, nothing fixed the problem.

5. The right side media clamp need to be changed again, its crooked. For whatever reason I am always having problems with that side.

6. The machine would stop printing, cutting for no reason. This maybe happens twice a month, when that happens, I had to restart the machine, redo the job again, otherwise print head would not go back, no error message neither. I know if I charge my cell phone on the same pc and unplug my phone will cause this, but it happens on its own too.

By the way, sending out a tech to look at it is not going to fix anything, my local dealer done that already, nothing fixed. I think parts need to be replaced at this point to fix the problems.



Thank you so very much for the case number. That helps a lot!


We will continue this conversation directly via email and possibly even phone calls. We will find a solution to all of the issues.


Chat with you soon.


Roland Technical Support
Roland DGA Corp.
Tel: 949-727-2100 Fax: 949-727-2112
rn
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
It's been over 2 months now since I have opened the case, all I got was an email saying you can not get hold of my local dealer in the last 2 weeks. I am tired of turning away customers because I can not cut anything thats more than 10-15" long, which is killing my business. For the few customers that I can keep, it takes forever to print their orders because I have to break down one print job into bunch of 10" long print jobs.

It looks like it won't be fixed any time soon, how about either send me a new unit and I will send mine back, or buy back my unit so I can try my luck with another company? I have never spent this much money on something with warranty then found out warranty doesn't really do much. When my $1k refrigerator broke down, not only I got it fixed within 3 days, they paid me $150 for the food inside too.
 
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