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mrfunone August 1st, 2012 10:39 AM

white ink
 
Hi.
What would you say is the most opaque white ink?
Thanks.

scott8801 August 1st, 2012 11:31 AM

Re: white ink
 
I like Unions cotton bright white.

mrfunone August 1st, 2012 11:47 AM

Re: white ink
 
Isn't there a way to measure the opacity of ink?
Like on a scale of 0 - 100?
I thought that there may be something like that somewhere.

thutch15 August 1st, 2012 12:12 PM

Re: white ink
 
I would say the most opaque white ink is a properly applied ink to the surface of the shirt and not into the knit.

ScreenFoo August 1st, 2012 01:28 PM

Re: white ink
 
You can use a draw down bar or something similar to compare samples if you want to test opacity--if you can afford one. Probably one of those preferably DIY kinda things.

Here's a link to a reasonably priced one: 8 PATH SCRAPER

tpitman August 4th, 2012 01:12 AM

Re: white ink
 
Opacity is a variable that hinges on the ink itself, which varies from brand, and even from batch to batch within a brand, screen mesh selection, tension, and emulsion coating technique that yields stencil thickness, and squeegee angle, pressure, and speed, and the sharpness and hardness of the blade.
What you want is an ink that clears the screen with minimal pressure so that it's not driven into the shirt. Much easier to control consistently on an automatic press as a manual.
Speaking of ink changing from batch to batch, Wednesday I went through a gallon of Union's Bright Cotton White that was significantly thicker than the last couple of gallons I've used. Don't know whether this was a bad batch, a container that sat in a hot warehouse or truck, or a change in formula. Same thing happened with the last gallon of QCM 158 Glacier White I bought a couple of years ago . . . thicker than the previous batches.

mrfunone August 4th, 2012 06:31 PM

Re: white ink
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by tpitman (Post 1146706)
Opacity is a variable that hinges on the ink itself, which varies from brand, and even from batch to batch within a brand, screen mesh selection, tension, and emulsion coating technique that yields stencil thickness, and squeegee angle, pressure, and speed, and the sharpness and hardness of the blade.
What you want is an ink that clears the screen with minimal pressure so that it's not driven into the shirt. Much easier to control consistently on an automatic press as a manual.
Speaking of ink changing from batch to batch, Wednesday I went through a gallon of Union's Bright Cotton White that was significantly thicker than the last couple of gallons I've used. Don't know whether this was a bad batch, a container that sat in a hot warehouse or truck, or a change in formula. Same thing happened with the last gallon of QCM 158 Glacier White I bought a couple of years ago . . . thicker than the previous batches.

Maybe mixing it will help?

beanie357 August 4th, 2012 07:24 PM

Re: white ink
 
Seems like Wilflex does okie dokie to our eye.
Kinda need to pick the white for your requirements it seems.

jfisk3475 August 4th, 2012 08:48 PM

Matsui flex ink. Low bleed and works on poly and cotton.

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tpitman August 5th, 2012 12:11 AM

Re: white ink
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by mrfunone (Post 1147060)
Maybe mixing it will help?

If you mean stirring the hell out of it, I put a paddle in my drill and let her rip. Loosens up a little, and this is in a garage in Florida in the summer, but still thicker than earlier batches.
Under the best circumstances, I would say QCM 158 is more "opaque" than Union Bright Cotton White, for me, with me pushing the squeegie. It lays down smoother, matting down the fibers better, and having more body, seems to cover better, meaning a brighter white. Again, that's for me.

BnC Custom Ink August 5th, 2012 08:50 AM

QCM 158 is very opake, and yes every couple of tubs may be thicker than others. The last one I got was like play doh till I hit it with the paddle for a while. But it is the closest I've ever gotten to a one hit
White.
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mrfunone August 5th, 2012 10:00 PM

Re: white ink
 
Guess I should get a few samples or small containers and try them out.

lknprints August 16th, 2012 05:25 PM

Re: white ink
 
We've also been testing several whites on our auto in the last couple of months. We have bought inks ranging from $35 per gallon up to $110 per gallon and still came back to our tried and true, QCM XOLB-158. At $68 per gallon it's the best mix for us.

porkchopharry August 18th, 2012 01:16 AM

Re: white ink
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by lknprints (Post 1153490)
We've also been testing several whites on our auto in the last couple of months. We have bought inks ranging from $35 per gallon up to $110 per gallon and still came back to our tried and true, QCM XOLB-158. At $68 per gallon it's the best mix for us.

By $110 per gallon are you referring to One Stroke? So far, in my limited time, I find their Hybrid white to be the best white ink I've used. Actually whenever I switch from any other colored ink to a One Stroke ink, I'm just blown away. I can't put my finger on it. It's like this really low luster look that I love.

That being said, I've been curious about the QCM as I can get it local and it's cheaper. Does it have a high gloss finish to it?

mustangFWL August 18th, 2012 04:21 AM

I don't see the appeal of one stroke... Their inks are nice yes... But they are so much more expansive than other inks that are equally nice... Like excaliburs inks... They are the smoothest and best covering inks I have found.. The one stroke poly inks are nice too, they cover great but at 40-50% more cost?

I guess the ink debate is the same as the Mac vs PC debate

porkchopharry August 18th, 2012 10:38 AM

Re: white ink
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by mustangFWL (Post 1154215)
I don't see the appeal of one stroke... Their inks are nice yes... But they are so much more expansive than other inks that are equally nice... Like excaliburs inks... They are the smoothest and best covering inks I have found.. The one stroke poly inks are nice too, they cover great but at 40-50% more cost?

I guess the ink debate is the same as the Mac vs PC debate

I have some Excalibur inks, and they are nice. But I also find that One Stroke has the look and feel that I like the best when the final product is cured.

Every other ink I have including Excalibur, when cured is kind of shiny and plastic feeling. The last Excalibur ink I used, steel grey was sure easy enough to use, but the end cure was very plastic feeling on the print, and very shiny. I think it was the 500 series Steel Grey. The One Stroke inks just feel more "natural" to me.

I went from Ryonet white to One Stroke Hybrid white. So it was like going from cement to butter.

To be fair, I haven't tried EVERY Excalibur ink out there, nor every One Stroke ink out there. So what I say probably doesn't mean a whole lot. But trust me, I am always on the lookout for cheaper inks that performs as well as One Stroke for ME.

Bear in mind, I do my own designs, I don't do jobs. But I will say that I consistently get better comments from customers who buy a shirt that I've printed with One Stroke than with the other inks. I just sort of build it into the price of a shirt.

The thing with One Stroke and price, is that what I have to do is usually test out a cheaper brand if it's a color I haven't tried yet on a design that I think will sell well from the start. usually though, once that color runs out, I'll replace it with the One Stroke version.

I just can't afford to drop the money on a mystery color from One Stroke if it's something I'll rarely use if the design bombs.

sben763 August 18th, 2012 12:53 PM

Re: white ink
 
Ive been using international coatings and are ok but I just bought a gallon of Excalibur artic white and its great. The cost $70 was no where near one stroke which I didn't like. Xenon sent me some samples and their white was very creamy, easy to print with and very opaque. Their cost is great now just have to work on the shipping cost and I may buy some ink from them.

Naptime August 18th, 2012 01:10 PM

Re: white ink
 
i have one stroke hybrid white.

i like it. but it's a bear to mix.

once it's mixed though, it's great printing with it. and i have no problems with dye migration on blends.

its the only ink i use from them though, everything else is union ink ultrasoft and maxopake.

i'll be dead before i finish this hybrid... made the mistake of buying a 5 gallon bucket. :mad:

BRTdesign August 18th, 2012 01:51 PM

Re: white ink
 
158 Creamy Glacier White XOLB QCM is the best white I have ever used

BRTdesign August 18th, 2012 01:52 PM

Re: white ink
 
and its creamy! and smooth!

porkchopharry August 18th, 2012 10:45 PM

Re: white ink
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Naptime (Post 1154474)
i have one stroke hybrid white.

i like it. but it's a bear to mix.

once it's mixed though, it's great printing with it. and i have no problems with dye migration on blends.

its the only ink i use from them though, everything else is union ink ultrasoft and maxopake.

i'll be dead before i finish this hybrid... made the mistake of buying a 5 gallon bucket. :mad:

Wow, that's odd, I don't think I've ever come across anyone who had a hard time mixing it. Matter of fact, most people I have come across don't EVEN mix it. I don't! I just plop some on the screen and after a couple passes it's great. Never had an issue not mixing it. Try it.

My biggest gripe with One Stroke is the price on their quarts. I do not like the fact that a quart is 1/2 the price (or more) of a gallon. I don't really mind their gallon prices. Their Hybrid Black isn't that much expensive for a gallon in my mind than anyone elses and it kicks ***. And if it's a color I'm going to use a lot of, I don't mind paying their gallon prices. But they really need to do something about their quart prices. Doing my own designs, I need to experiment with colors and I will usually either have to ask for a sample from them and wait, or try another cheaper brand that I can grab local.

lknprints August 19th, 2012 03:00 AM

Re: white ink
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by porkchopharry (Post 1154187)
By $110 per gallon are you referring to One Stroke? So far, in my limited time, I find their Hybrid white to be the best white ink I've used. Actually whenever I switch from any other colored ink to a One Stroke ink, I'm just blown away. I can't put my finger on it. It's like this really low luster look that I love.

That being said, I've been curious about the QCM as I can get it local and it's cheaper. Does it have a high gloss finish to it?

Pork- The white at $110 wasn't OneStroke, it was actually a Rutland. I don't remember exactly what it's called. I can check later. We never buy One Stoke stuff because it's so expensive and has to come to us from Kentucky.

I would not say that the QCM has a high gloss finish as all. It's just an all around good white. If you can get it locally I would at least buy a gallon to try.

porkchopharry August 19th, 2012 10:56 AM

Re: white ink
 
I will try some QCM then as I can grab it local. I'm always open to trying new ink. If I can find an ink that works as well as One Stroke for me, and it is cheaper and can be sourced local, I'm always down.

I think the One Stroke white is around $110 a gallon which is why I asked. And yeah the transit from Kentucky to wherever (Los Angeles for me), is kind of a bear. My sales guy there was telling me they are starting to work with UPS on quicker ship times and lower shipping costs to the rest of the country though.

TshirtStan August 19th, 2012 12:11 PM

I just want to put my mind at rest and reply. Yes, I agree that One Stroke is a TON more expensive. I went through a couple gallons of white and didn't see a difference versus paying almost 50 percent more than traditional ink. And..... Whatever you are used to works fine. Me, I use Ryonet white with no issues I can see. When I print 50/50 Hanes I use poly white only from Ryonet. I think it is International Coatings branded. But one and use it and see if you like it. Then make your own call.

BRTdesign August 19th, 2012 12:22 PM

Re: white ink
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by porkchopharry (Post 1154858)
I will try some QCM then as I can grab it local. I'm always open to trying new ink. If I can find an ink that works as well as One Stroke for me, and it is cheaper and can be sourced local, I'm always down.

I think the One Stroke white is around $110 a gallon which is why I asked. And yeah the transit from Kentucky to wherever (Los Angeles for me), is kind of a bear. My sales guy there was telling me they are starting to work with UPS on quicker ship times and lower shipping costs to the rest of the country though.

you will love this ink I get it for about $50 at atlas screen supply company its a lot better than the Ryonet brand that is just I.C ink they just add Ryonet to the label but the QCM pulls easy! you will never use another ink again LOL :D

BRTdesign August 19th, 2012 12:23 PM

Re: white ink
 
$50 a gallon

lknprints August 19th, 2012 02:40 PM

Re: white ink
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by BRTdesign (Post 1154892)
you will love this ink I get it for about $50 at atlas screen supply company its a lot better than the Ryonet brand that is just I.C ink they just add Ryonet to the label but the QCM pulls easy! you will never use another ink again LOL :D


Holy crap! I just went to Atlas and it really is that cheap! I can't believe that they sell it for $44 per gallon for 5's! I just bought 10 gallons with shipping for $544! That's a ton cheaper than I've been paying! Thanks Dude!

porkchopharry August 19th, 2012 02:46 PM

Re: white ink
 
Is QCM XOLB High Opacity? No underbase necessary? I'm speaking of the colors.

lknprints August 19th, 2012 02:48 PM

Re: white ink
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by lknprints (Post 1154944)
Holy crap! I just went to Atlas and it really is that cheap! I can't believe that they sell it for $44 per gallon for 5's! I just bought 10 gallons with shipping for $544! That's a ton cheaper than I've been paying! Thanks Dude!

Correction It was only $527 for 10 Gallons!

lknprints August 19th, 2012 02:49 PM

Re: white ink
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by porkchopharry (Post 1154946)
Is QCM XOLB High Opacity? No underbase necessary? I'm speaking of the colors.

Pork - We honestly use it for everything. We actually think it down a little on our auto and Print, Flash, Print for underbase and straight white prints.

I think the XOLB means -- Extra Opaque Low Opacity.

Trust me, it's a beast!

porkchopharry August 19th, 2012 02:52 PM

Re: white ink
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by lknprints (Post 1154948)
Correction It was only $527 for 10 Gallons!

Even cheaper here, which is local to me. Not sure what they charge for shipping though.

QCM XOLB Series bestscreenprintingsupply.com

lknprints August 19th, 2012 03:19 PM

Re: white ink
 
That's not the same stuff that we use. If you click on it you will see that it's the XOLB 132 not 158. We use the 158. I'm not sure what the difference is though.

BRTdesign August 19th, 2012 04:23 PM

Re: white ink
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by lknprints (Post 1154944)
Holy crap! I just went to Atlas and it really is that cheap! I can't believe that they sell it for $44 per gallon for 5's! I just bought 10 gallons with shipping for $544! That's a ton cheaper than I've been paying! Thanks Dude!

your welcome man! :D

porkchopharry August 19th, 2012 10:52 PM

Re: white ink
 
I wonder what the difference is in the XOLB's? And I see that the XOLB colors, they claim need no underbase, but only recommend using up to a 160 mesh. I USED to use nothing lower than 160, now I'm moving up to 180 and beyond. Ah well, I guess for the price, it can't hurt to experiment.

tpitman August 20th, 2012 12:34 AM

Re: white ink
 
I use the XOLB Royal Blue, Bright Red and Golden Yellow frequently, but the only color you might get away with no under base on black with is the blue. Even then, I've printed the blue over gold shirts and the shirt color will have an effect on the final ink color as opposed to printing the blue over a white shirt.

That isn't to say you can't print/flash/print them without an underbase, much as you can Union's Maxopake series, but they won't be as bright as with a white underbase.

BnC Custom Ink August 20th, 2012 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by porkchopharry (Post 1155125)
I wonder what the difference is in the XOLB's? And I see that the XOLB colors, they claim need no underbase, but only recommend using up to a 160 mesh. I USED to use nothing lower than 160, now I'm moving up to 180 and beyond. Ah well, I guess for the price, it can't hurt to experiment.

XOLB = Extra Opake Low Bleed

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porkchopharry August 20th, 2012 05:00 PM

Re: white ink
 
The poster above me mentions there was an XOLB 132 and an XOLB 158?


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