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Solids are KILLING ME!!

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Old August 13th, 2013 Aug 13, 2013 3:56:30 PM -   #46 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

I only had a few small chunks in there... Nothing too major. I am not sure how much it helped by removing the buildup because after I was still having some pattern issues.

On another note, I would probably start flushing out your viper with anti venom 2-3 times per week. Water ... Even hot, doesn't get rid of the sticky polymers that build up from pretreat. That stuff is like rubber cement when It dries.

If you don't want to waste too much anti venom, you could try flushing with 50/50 distilled water and AV instead. Maybe use 100% AV once or twice a week and 50-50 just about every time you flush it out. In the long run it will rid of all the headaches associated with spray pattern issues with the Viper One
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Old August 13th, 2013 Aug 13, 2013 4:30:14 PM -   #47 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

Last question, what part of the valve assembly was the hardest to take apart?
 
Old August 13th, 2013 Aug 13, 2013 4:34:05 PM -   #48 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

For me it was the part where you have to try to fit a wrench on the only thin spot without the very fine threading on it and then another wrench on the middle part and twist each away from one another to get it apart. That threading is very sensitive and my wrench kept slipping and denting / smoothing it.
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Last edited by jmcgurren; August 14th, 2013 at 05:44 AM..
 
 
Old August 22nd, 2013 Aug 22, 2013 2:03:06 PM -   #49 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

Maybe.........just maybe I have solved our problem with printing solid colors. Here is what we did (will post pictures later):

Used keya 180 yellow tees
prepressed 15 seconds @ 20psi & 325 degrees
first pretreatment was 1 pass at 9 on the viper one, hoover 30 seconds and press @ 20 psi/325 degrees x 2 (10 sec each)using quilion paper (we think the kraft paper was leaving some fibers on the shirt), pretreated again 1 pass @ 13.5 (which is all the viper one will go to) then press as above.
Printed using black/red high res on dark background
Cured- hoover 30-45 seconds 90 sec x 2 using silicon paper with kraft paper on top of it- 325 degrees @ 20 psi.

Print had no pin holes and/or color missing that I can see. A couple of things I think we learned here is the two pretreatments seemed to be a big benefit and the kraft paper seemed to leave some fibers on the shirt when drying pretreatment (not sure if it was just the sheet or what). First wash test was just fine, plan on two more before I post the pictures. Initial summary is this may have fixed the problem.

Any thoughts on the two preatment methods and/or thoughts of how much pt that is laying down? I am wondering if increasing the pt level and doing one pass would work or if the two passed helps in more uniform coverage.
 
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Old August 22nd, 2013 Aug 22, 2013 5:50:54 PM -   #50 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

Now you just have to be sure it will pass wash tests.
 
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Old August 22nd, 2013 Aug 22, 2013 6:50:44 PM -   #51 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

Well guess what....................failed wash test. First wash looked good, after wash 2 & 3 print is coming off the shirt- too much pretreatment I guess.

Also tried the same exact steps tonight and they printed like before pinholes, spots, whatever you want to call them in the lettering. Go figure.............................

What confuses me here is there is a patch of grass with a football in it that is the majority of the design and there are no issues with it just the lettering. Hopefully the picture will show what I mean, one wash on this shirt.

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Old August 23rd, 2013 Aug 23, 2013 9:47:30 AM -   #52 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

Larry, I notice sometimes the solids peel off easier if pretreat is wrong and gradients tend to hold better until more washes when they start to flake a bit. This method is crazy anyways.. pretreating and curing twice along with printing and curing is WAY too long of process for one shirt. Think about how many shirts you would even be able to fit in one day especially if it is front and back prints... not many.
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Old August 23rd, 2013 Aug 23, 2013 10:34:22 AM -   #53 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

2 passes at 14 turns is equal to about 4 turns. Each turn doesn't reduce by half, once your get into higher turns it can be just a half if grsm difference. The gradients always print better because usually using less white ink underneath. The less white the easier to cure and less chance of peeling. Think about never peel on white shirt. So more white ink I use a little more pressure and drying time. For screen printers drying time not all the same for inks. When I do production mode I actually reduce drying g time by 30 seconds because here's that much less white so no need to worry.
I believe the inky shirts that can sprayed twice is like a gildan ultra or a heavy hoodie.
Yes with Kraft paper once it starts to grab black fibers from shirt time to change or flip over. It should
Last at least 3 dozen shirts.
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Old October 1st, 2013 Oct 1, 2013 8:36:18 PM -   #54 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

SOLIDS ARE KILLING-- YELLOW for sure.

Does anyone else have an issue printing solid yellow? On the attached picture please tell me what is wrong. It is a LAT tee, prepressed 10 seconds, 20 psi 325 degrees, pretreatment IA @ 4 on the viperone (with a new green spray tip),brushed and pressed wet at 20 psi, 325 degrees for 30 seconds covered with quilon paper, printed in black/dark high res and dark background and cured 20 psi 325 degrees 90 seconds x 2 with silicon paper.

F1 clean and perfect nozzle check prior to printing. White underbase looked great and not the letters look likes............. Yellow makes me want to drink scotch to the extreme.

Tomorrow I am going to try a setting of 3 on the viperone and see if more pt helps. Everything I have tried IA has printed great- flaming guitar looks fantastic- it even improves a gildan (not that I will use one on dtg anymore). Any suggestions and/or thoughts here??

Thanks
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Old October 1st, 2013 Oct 1, 2013 9:33:27 PM -   #55 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

Honest truth, the yellow looks exactly the same to me as the white if you are talking about the subtle pinholes. Yellow is so transparent (remember CMYK) so its really only about the white.

These solid letters and logos are actually tougher to print than full color photos which really dont use as much white due to all the gradations in color. Last time I heard for IA its a starting point of 18-22 grams. If so, at 3 turns you are at about 15+ grams. Not that it is the case but Id have a start of about 1.75-2 turns, around 20grams. If it looks good then dial it down and save; crappy turn it up.

Just a few questions to chew on... I cant tell, are the photos after being pressed? I noticed you also use the same amount of pressure when drying the pretreat and curing the print. Production or Hi-Res?
 
Old October 2nd, 2013 Oct 2, 2013 9:28:54 AM -   #56 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

Just thinking would going the colored background instead of dark since it should laydown more white ink? Just a thought.
 
Old October 2nd, 2013 Oct 2, 2013 7:24:42 PM -   #57 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

I would say more pretreat... especially since IA says it won't affect washability. There is probably nothing else that will solve that. You are doing everything else right it sounds like. I have experienced the same problem with yellow. For some reason neorip doesn't underbase solid yellows as good as it does with other colors. I know this for a fact because I have printed a sample wash test print over 100 times and it has solid blocks of all colors and gradients of all colors.. yellow always looks the worst with pin holes. You actually aren't too far off from the looks of your picture.
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Last edited by jmcgurren; October 2nd, 2013 at 07:27 PM.. Reason: mistake in info
 
Old October 3rd, 2013 Oct 3, 2013 9:43:15 AM -   #58 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

Yeah solids are so fun, so heres some recents one pic is right after print before dry,2 are poor images after drying,one is good image after drying.
I want to hear what you guys would have done to solve the problem, than I will tell what I did, pretreat was not an issue, on some of print I outdoes 3 sprays at 5 turns it was soaking but I wanted to take that variable out of picture. The final good print was 2 turns of 6.
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Old October 3rd, 2013 Oct 3, 2013 12:02:02 PM -   #59 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

Well??!?!?! What did you do man? I think we have all ran into these issues...I have found it best to hover for a minute prior to curing but it doesn't always help.
 
Old October 3rd, 2013 Oct 3, 2013 1:47:17 PM -   #60 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

Haha that's what I did,
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