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Solids are KILLING ME!!

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Old August 10th, 2013 Aug 10, 2013 9:35:53 PM -   #16 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

the american apparel 2001 print great, thats what i won DTG battle royal with. Thats not the issue because on front we he solid colors to print.

Im assuming this in in high res, Ive seen you on here for a while and i know you know what your doing.

try reducing white just a little and adding more color strength.

if your other prints printed fine this week im would say dont rip aparet print head, or dampers so quickly. have you tried adjusting color outputs individually

Lastly check your spray nozzle at times it looks like its a full spray but certain areas are getting extra and other areas less, i had these spray tips im actually working on a new material that doesnt need clean as easy. I would take a bad shirt and only turn nozzle once and spray let sit for couple minutes and you can see when starts to dry if even or if certain areas have less or more. i think i change my nozzle one a month lol
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Old August 11th, 2013 Aug 11, 2013 7:57:50 AM -   #17 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by g.lupo
the american apparel 2001 print great, thats what i won DTG battle royal with. Thats not the issue because on front we he solid colors to print.

Im assuming this in in high res, Ive seen you on here for a while and i know you know what your doing.

try reducing white just a little and adding more color strength.

if your other prints printed fine this week im would say dont rip aparet print head, or dampers so quickly. have you tried adjusting color outputs individually

Lastly check your spray nozzle at times it looks like its a full spray but certain areas are getting extra and other areas less, i had these spray tips im actually working on a new material that doesnt need clean as easy. I would take a bad shirt and only turn nozzle once and spray let sit for couple minutes and you can see when starts to dry if even or if certain areas have less or more. i think i change my nozzle one a month lol
Yeah I have had great success with other prints on american apparel in the past too. To me it looks as though I am not getting enough white base, in the solid white areas the image is pitted. I am getting a good nozzle check but I am not sure if I getting the full volume of ink through the nozzles when printing. This leads me to think either I have a bad or failing damper(s) or something is going on with the PT.

I do not have a wagner, only the ViperOne. When I moved into my retail store, I bought a smaller 5 gallon compressor. I was using a 60 gallon and I am thinking that the volume of air is so much lower that I need to slow the spray head down some to compensate for it. Some of you are probably not going to understand the dynamics of air volume vs air pressure but 45psi is not just 45psi, the amount of volume plays a big role in how strong that 45psi really is. So I replaced the tip and did 1 pass with 5 turns and printed a big solid white box that looked pretty good before curing. Once I cured the shirt it was pitted..not sure if that might be a temperature issue, pressure or what. I cured for 90 seconds x 2 at 340f with light pressure. I then printed another image with 2 passes of 14 turns on the ViperOne, brushing with a wooster after each pass, pressed at 340f for 30 secs and it looks decent but still showed some pitting in the solid white. I then washed the 2nd shirt in cold water, out of the washing machine it was already starting to peel which tells me it was too much PT.

So today I am going out to the shop to replace the ebay dampers with cleaned OEM units. I am going to also clean the spikes going into the dampers. (I cleaned the spikes going into the carts yesterday). Hopefully that will make all these issues go away.
 
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Old August 11th, 2013 Aug 11, 2013 8:19:39 AM -   #18 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

Hey Eric maybe I missed a post about the ebay dampers... are you having issues with them? I have been using them for a while now without any problems that I have noticed.

As for the solids.. I have always had similar looking prints on certain brands. Maybe not as bad as the image you are posting though. Did you get solids like that with Keya? Keya seemed pretty good for me at 7 turns with solid fonts and stuff.
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Old August 11th, 2013 Aug 11, 2013 10:06:00 AM -   #19 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

Are you diluting pretreat from concentrate? We had some shirts printed that had pitting after curing. Turned out that they used regular water instead of distilled water when diluting concentrated pretreat.
 
Old August 11th, 2013 Aug 11, 2013 10:29:05 AM -   #20 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

With eBay dampers its hit miss, some bad in2 days some last long time. How did you clean spikes going into cleaning carts? I haven't figured that out only spikes in damper I clean.
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Old August 12th, 2013 Aug 12, 2013 11:10:54 AM -   #21 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

So yesterday I came into the shop and replaced all the ebay dampers with oem epson units (white side only). I also changed the tip in my ViperOne and I am still not getting good even white coverage...let me rephrase that, I have pretty good prints coming off the printer but after curing I have got major pitting. I have ordered several new ViperOne tips and plan to replace the current tip again hoping that it will fix the issue. I also bumped my air pressure up to 105psi going into the PT canister but that didn't seem to do anything either. Along with increasing the air pressure from the compressor I also switched to using the teflon sheet instead of quilon paper for drying the PT in the hopes that I would get a smoother print surface.

Any other suggestions?
 
Old August 12th, 2013 Aug 12, 2013 12:20:21 PM -   #22 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

I have no clue, but was just wondering if everyone drains the condensation from their compressor on a regular basis, and to use a separator on the outlet .... I don't know just a thought...
 
Old August 12th, 2013 Aug 12, 2013 1:55:48 PM -   #23 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

So after doing some more tests...I have finally gotten a good solid white as seen in the first pic - BEFORE CURING the ink. The second pic shows what my image looks like AFTER its been cured.

Any suggestions for me? Increase heat, decrease heat, pressure, time etc?
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File Type: jpg Before Curing.jpg (1,014.3 KB, 90 views)
File Type: jpg After Curing.jpg (1.19 MB, 90 views)
 
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Old August 12th, 2013 Aug 12, 2013 2:40:41 PM -   #24 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

You're making progress Eric - that's a huge improvement over the first pic you posted.

Is there one thing you did that you can attribute the progress to?
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Old August 12th, 2013 Aug 12, 2013 3:00:44 PM -   #25 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stitch-Up
You're making progress Eric - that's a huge improvement over the first pic you posted.

Is there one thing you did that you can attribute the progress to?
I'm not sure what the situation is honestly. I put twice as much PT as usual on the blank and I got much better white prints. But I am not sure if they will pass the wash test. I have several new ViperOne spray tips coming tomorrow so hopefully that will resolve more of the issues. Its very frustrating!!
 
Old August 12th, 2013 Aug 12, 2013 3:10:03 PM -   #26 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

It's all about reducing the pre-treat to that 'sweet point' where you get good white coverage + good wash fastness. This is what Jeff spent so much time experimenting with.

When I pre-treat with the gun and then bush with the Wooster, I like to see the brush strokes in the pre-treat, not heavy but an indication - usually whiteish brush strokes.
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Old August 12th, 2013 Aug 12, 2013 4:56:42 PM -   #27 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

Eric I do see a streak line in your print on that fits one where it looks like te viper is streaking. To solve it I actually had to change out the canister, canister top, tip, and the tubes. Not sure which of those solved it, but something was causing it. I actually do not think it was the tip... At least not totally from the tests I had done after replacing each component.
Did you try spraying on a athletic gray shirt to see your pattern more clearly?
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Old August 12th, 2013 Aug 12, 2013 5:03:31 PM -   #28 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

Oh, also.. I took the spray valve inside the viper totally apart and cleaner out all the build up. This maybe have helped too. I have a PDF of how to do it. It might take a little bit of time and there is a certain part that is very hard to get off without damaging the threads. I actually did damage mine a but but it still threaded back on so I didn't ruin it. I-group is supposed to be coming out with a tool (or maybe they already did) that gets the valves apart easier without damaging that specific part.
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Old August 13th, 2013 Aug 13, 2013 7:07:53 AM -   #29 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

Jeff...I am ready to try anything. Can you send me the PDF for disassembling the valve? [email protected]
 
Old August 13th, 2013 Aug 13, 2013 7:18:59 AM -   #30 (permalink)
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Default Re: Solids are KILLING ME!!

Eric,

i'm just curious if you have tried this on a different brand of shirt. maybe it's possible that the batch of 2001 shirts you have are slightly different which is causing these results. the pits in the white after your cure lends me to think that the weave of the shirt isn't tight, so the ink is pulling back against the threads. i know this style has been printed on successfully, but maybe the ones you have have been re-dyed or something else that is making this happen.
 






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