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Epson C120 Or Epson 1400 for Transfers

 
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Old June 4th, 2008 Jun 4, 2008 10:38:28 AM -   #1 (permalink)
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Default Epson C120 Or Epson 1400 for Transfers

I figure you guys up here can help me make a decision on what printer to get I already have the Epson C120 but I haven't open the box yet because I was thinking that maybe I should get the Epson 1400 since it's a wide format printer.

Also I didn't want to use a CIS system so I guess the next question is how do the 2 different inks compare to each other? or should I say the 2 different printers.

I just to make sure I give people a good quality shirt that's not going to fade right away. And do Solvent transfer last longer?
 
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Old August 18th, 2008 Aug 18, 2008 11:57:54 AM -   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Epson C120 Or Epson 1400 for Transfers

This is a post of a pm Spank and I thought we should share with everyone - just in case one day - someone else had similar questions and could possibly benefit from the information. I always figure, once the typing is done, it's a shame to keep it hidden in pm, keeping the info on the boards has the potential to benefit many, where as pm's benefit one.

The reason I chose this thread was because the c88 and the c120 are fundamentally the same as far as format size and the standard ink they come with: Durabrite. So this pm is completely on topic for the original question posted in this thread. A day late and probably a dollar short, but the Q in this thread never got a response, and this will address that as well. Here we go, with Spank's a-ok to put his pm out here (thanks, Spank):

Quote:
Originally Posted by spankthafunk
I noticed in a post you have a couple of Epson 1400s. Would you mind answering a couple of questions for me, for I am new and only used to Screen Printing.

The Epson 88 and 1400 are for printin transfers correct?

Do you need special inks, or can you use the inks they come with?

The only difference between the two printers is the size right?

Is it a post script printer?

I'm a screen printer and have been looking into printing transfers for custom orders. It looks like this is the main printer for most people, but I just wanted to see what else I will need to buy (aside from a heat press) to get rollin. Thanks!

Quote:
Originally Posted by girlzndollz
Quote:
Originally Posted by spankthafunk
I noticed in a post you have a couple of Epson 1400s. Would you mind answering a couple of questions for me, for I am new and only used to Screen Printing.
Sure thing, Spank. I will certainly try for you. I don't own the 1400, but am trying so hard to find a reason to NOT buy it, lol, as I have 4 Epsons here, and one at my mom's, but none of mine are wide format, or print direct to dvd/cd (I really would like that feature as well.)


Quote:
Originally Posted by spankthafunk
The Epson 88 and 1400 are for printin transfers correct?
Yes, both can be used for transfers.


Quote:
Originally Posted by spankthafunk
Do you need special inks, or can you use the inks they come with?
Tricky question for both printers. The answer is yes you can use the inks that come with either of these printers. Here's where the trick comes in:

Durabrite comes in the c88 and c88+. I have this printer. Durabrite ink is prone to color shifting under the heat of the press. My Durabrites haven't shifted, but alot of users of the ink have this problem. For that reason, Durabrite is the least recommended ink of the pigment inks. The 3rd party generic ink replacements (in either re-fill carts or bulk ink systems) solve the color shift problem for folks. Ultra Chrome pigment ink hasn't been sited as having color shifting issues.

The 1400 comes with Claria ink. Claria ink is a "water resisntant" dye ink. Regular photographic dye ink will wash out of transfers. Claria is different (being water resistant). It isn't called by Epson a photographic dye, Epson calls it a Hi-Definition ink.

Some folks will only use pigment ink because before Claria, we could only choose from pigment and photographic dye ink. Claria is a new breed of ink. It works with transfer papers.

Is this new? Yes. Are all folks comfortable with it? No. The only way for you to be sure that you want to use the new Claria ink is to read on the forum from folks who use it. They post pictures and the ones who use it do love their transfers. The list of papers folks have tested with it grows all the time. Maybe in two years, it will be common for folks to say "use pigment or Claria", but for now, there are tests, skeptisism, and yes, Claria already has a group loyal users, and that group seems to grow all the time.

If I bought a 1400, I would be comfortable using the Claria ink on my JPSS or Ironall Dark. I have been watching Claria from the moment it arrived, friends have done testing and posted pics and evaluations. Tho I really think each person has to make their own choice because what if you wanted to use a paper no one has tested with Claria before, Spank, and for whatever reason, pigment worked better?

Folks get fading with Durabrite, so there's no guarentee each paper and ink combination will work out great. I've had Ironall and Durabrite fade on one brand of tee shirt, but not lose a bit of color on another brand of tee shirt. That's because the shirt can have just as big an impact on colorfastness as the paper and the ink.

I hope this helps give you a much truer answer than just "yes, the ink from both will work." That is true, but there are these other things to consider when choosing.


Quote:
Originally Posted by spankthafunk
The only difference between the two printers is the size right?
More than that. Now you know the ink formulations are different. The c88 has larger nozzles than the 1400 because pigment drops are larger than dye.

The c88+ has only 4 carts, the 1400 has 6. The debate rages on about whether that only raises the cost of ink, as the extra two colors aren't needed to produce a nice transfer. There are arguements on both sides. The only thing I know for sure is the 1400 has 2 extra carts.

Quote:
Originally Posted by spankthafunk
Is it a post script printer?
I don't know. I did find this thread for you tho, about postscript, ghostscript, etc. I don't screen, but hope this information on the printers by other who do screen will help you with that Q.
https://www.t-shirtforums.com/screen-...tml#post323009

Quote:
Originally Posted by spankthafunk
I'm a screen printer and have been looking into printing transfers for custom orders. It looks like this is the main printer for most people, but I just wanted to see what else I will need to buy (aside from a heat press) to get rollin. Thanks!
Folks use the Epsons' alot because they come with pigment ink, and full pigments, not just the black pigment. Alot of HP's only have pigment blacks, and the colors are dyes.

There are alot of re-fill carts and bulk systems for the Epsons. Some folks use Canon's as well. I know of a few members who bought bulk pigment systems for their Canon printers and are happy.

Another useful tool but not completely necessary is a teflon sheet. Some folks use parchment paper (baking paper on a roll) to protect their upper platen, but I like the teflon as it helps prevent scorching of the fabric.
Have a great day,
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Old August 18th, 2008 Aug 18, 2008 12:34:51 PM -   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Epson C120 Or Epson 1400 for Transfers

Thanks for reposting this Kelly. That is my philosophy exactly

Quote:
I always figure, once the typing is done, it's a shame to keep it hidden in pm, keeping the info on the boards has the potential to benefit many, where as pm's benefit one.
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Old August 18th, 2008 Aug 18, 2008 1:01:11 PM -   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Epson C120 Or Epson 1400 for Transfers

You're welcome, Rodney. I have a few more follow ups to post here as well. I am really glad Spank is comfortable with this. Here we go - to follow ups:

Quote:
Originally Posted by spankthafunk
haha No worries, this was a great explanation! Definently post away, I just didn't want to take up any more posts on this. Sometimes when you post, you get partial answers also, but you have completely provided me with everyone I was asking. Thank you!

What kind of inks usually come with these printers? Are they dye inks? I guess the question is if you buy a c88, does it come with dye ink? And then you just need to buy pigment ink for it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by girlzndollz
Thank you, Spank. I remember when I joined, I got bits and pieces of info from different people. Like puzzle parts one at a time. From there, I decided when I finally had knowledge, I was going to give complete answers, the best I could anyway... so I completely relate to what you are saying... but thanks for the remark. It makes me feel good, because it lets me know I am giving the kind of help I wanted to try to give folks.

Okay, the c88 comes with Durabrite ink, which is a pigment ink. You can use the Durabrite, and if you get color shifting, you can switch over the a 3rd party re-fill cart or bulk ink system to get away from the color shifting.

If you don't have color shifting, you can certainly stay with the Epson carts with Durabrite ink, but that is a costly way to print the shirts. The oem carts are alot more money then re-fill carts and the bulk systems.

The c88's are replaced in the Epson line up by the C120. Epson.com has c120's (refurbs) for $39 with free shipping. (My second one arrived today.) All of my printers are refurbs and I don't have any problems with them, beyond completely normal inkjet issues. All work like new ones.
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Old August 18th, 2008 Aug 18, 2008 1:11:42 PM -   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Epson C120 Or Epson 1400 for Transfers

I have to type more than quotes to be able to post it so I'll say here is the next set of pm's from us:

Quote:
Originally Posted by spankthafunk
Awesome. And you said the 1400s come with the Claria ink, correct?

So I dont want to beat a dead bush, but can you just tell me I have this right:

I can order a c88 from Epson (which comes with pigmented ink). I can then get a heat press, a teflon sheet, a t-shirt, and a piece of JPSS (or other type of) transfer paper. With just those four items, I can print onto the paper and press it to the shirt, without having to do anything with the ink system as is. If I am planning on printing a lot of shirts, then I would consider buying a bulk or refill system. Is this correct?

Also, pigmented inks dont wash out, bleed, run, or anything else on shirts? Is this method only for a certain type of shirt, like 100% cotton or only polyester?
Quote:
Originally Posted by girlzndollz
Quote:
Originally Posted by spankthafunk
Awesome. And you said the 1400s come with the Claria ink, correct?


Yes, that's right.

Quote:
Originally Posted by spankthafunk
So I dont want to beat a dead bush, but can you just tell me I have this right:
Quote:
Originally Posted by spankthafunk

I can order a c88 from Epson (which comes with pigmented ink). I can then get a heat press, a teflon sheet, a t-shirt, and a piece of JPSS (or other type of) transfer paper. With just those four items, I can print onto the paper and press it to the shirt, without having to do anything with the ink system as is.
Yes to all of it except one thing (and please think about using the JPSS over other papers).

The only hitch in your statement is the last part of the it. Yes, you can do this, but in the printer preferences, you will most likely have to change the color settings on your c88.

The c88's run very heavy in yellow tint. Most of us change the color settings to magenta +5, cyan +5, and yellow -20. The range of yellow settings are -15 to -25, depending on what you prefer. Once you update the settings to these, you are good to go.

Quote:
Originally Posted by spankthafunk
If I am planning on printing a lot of shirts, then I would consider buying a bulk or refill system. Is this correct?


Yes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by spankthafunk
Also, pigmented inks dont wash out, bleed, run, or anything else on shirts? Is this method only for a certain type of shirt, like 100% cotton or only polyester?
Inkjet heat transfers are for 100% cotton or 50/50 cotton/poly blends. I like the 50/50's. Not for polyester.

Pigment inks can wash out. If you used Ironall paper with Durabrite, you can easily encounter fade depending on what tee shirt you use.

If you use Jerzees 29B shirt with Ironall and Durabrite, my experience is no fade.

The only paper for lights that I will use on t-shirts is JPSS/Jetprosofstretch. I can use any shirt I have in stock, and it does not fade.

Fading has to do with the shirt, the ink and the paper used. One of these variables changed, and your results can change. Not so much with JPSS paper. I've used regular photographic dye, and bleached the shirt now about 12 times, and there is no fade. That is why I love JPSS. It is a remarkable paper that consistently gives you a great product.
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Old August 18th, 2008 Aug 18, 2008 1:14:31 PM -   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Epson C120 Or Epson 1400 for Transfers

Quote:
Originally Posted by spankthafunk
Awesome, then it sounds like if I buy one of these cheaper heat presses (the Seika from SunIE - $295) I'm reading about, then I might be up and running for almost under $600.


It could definitely happen.

Quote:
Originally Posted by spankthafunk
I hope I'm not bothering you with questions, we can take this to the forum if you would rather everyone see all this. or keep copying, but which papers do you recommend for darks?


No problem at all. I'll just add them to that thread. We've already done all the typing, no sense in typing them twice. I'm glad you are good with us posting a copy there tho.

The paper for darks that I like is Ironall Dark. There have been quality issues lately, but when there are no issues, that is my fav paper: colorfast, stretches with the shirt instead of cracking, and is does not have a heavy hand, tho being a dark paper, it does have a hand. I am going to test JetWear (the same paper as Alpha Gold for darks but less expensive) as my #2 paper.

Hey, I hope things go great for you with the heat transfers. It's really a pretty fun and simple process, once you get it down pat. Hopefully it helps you and yours get into that place of your dreams. All the best to you, Spank.

Look up a thread called "lasting image" when you are ready to press your shirt. I wrote a post about how to heat press step-by-step. Removing moisture, stretching the shirt, etc, and the reasons why. Hopefully it will help everything go very smoothly for you right from the start.
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Old August 18th, 2008 Aug 18, 2008 1:20:01 PM -   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Epson C120 Or Epson 1400 for Transfers

I would choose the c120 for economic reasons. The cost of the c120 is less and it also uses less ink cartridges and it has double black cartridges. ... JB
 
Old August 19th, 2008 Aug 19, 2008 5:47:36 PM -   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Epson C120 Or Epson 1400 for Transfers

Great answers Kelly, thanks!
 
Old August 19th, 2008 Aug 19, 2008 6:08:49 PM -   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Epson C120 Or Epson 1400 for Transfers

Couple of questions refill cartridges, figured I'd keep this out of the PM and all the reposting.

1) The c120s can use refill cartridges correct?

2) Can you recommend which ones are best and/or which ones are the most affordable?

3) Will there be any problems with the new refill cartridges, if I initially print with the cartridges that the printer comes with? In other words, will I get clogging or will I need to flush out the old inks if I install new cartridges?
 
Old August 19th, 2008 Aug 19, 2008 7:46:33 PM -   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Epson C120 Or Epson 1400 for Transfers

Quote:
Originally Posted by spankthafunk
Couple of questions refill cartridges, figured I'd keep this out of the PM and all the reposting.

1) The c120s can use refill cartridges correct?
Yes. They definitely can.

Quote:

2) Can you recommend which ones are best and/or which ones are the most affordable?
I did not buy the refill carts yet (must get to this because of the ink costs.) But, after all the reading I have done, I would follow my friend Melissa/angelicendeavors to this supplier. Other folks have used this supplier for their c88's and c120's. If you do a search for inkjetcarts.us, you'll find reviews on this supplier. Most seem happy, but not everyone, but I always think with things like these carts and bulk systems, it's not always going to go smooth for each user and some folks may not be happy.
Find Ink Jet Carts:Epson:C Models:C120

This is a link to the page for the c120. There are certainly other suppliers of re-fill carts. The forum sponsor's carry systems (I don't know who carries carts and who carries bulk.) There's also dyesubshop.com.

There are more than that, but I don't remember many of them because when I finally decided on the above system, I stopped storing alot of the other info in my head. A search of the forum will bring back alot more info on it.

I am happy with what I know about the above. I hear installation can be tough, but once installed - folks seem reallyyyyyy happy. Sounded good to me.

Quote:
3) Will there be any problems with the new refill cartridges, if I initially print with the cartridges that the printer comes with? In other words, will I get clogging or will I need to flush out the old inks if I install new cartridges?

This I am not positive. You know what, I will post a thread as I would like to know definitively as well.
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Last edited by Girlzndollz; August 19th, 2008 at 07:56 PM.. Reason: totally shortened a whole section due to posting thread to get answer.
 
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Old August 19th, 2008 Aug 19, 2008 7:53:44 PM -   #11 (permalink)
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Default Re: Epson C120 Or Epson 1400 for Transfers

Spank: https://www.t-shirtforums.com/heat-pr...tml#post348246
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Old July 7th, 2017 Jul 7, 2017 8:24:37 AM -   #12 (permalink)
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Default Re: Epson C120 Or Epson 1400 for Transfers

I have an epson 1400 that i just got free from a thrift store.... (it works fine!!)
I am interested i switching it to a CIS system for the sublimate ink... is there a link here or do you know where I can look that information up?
TIA!





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