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[DIY DTG] Moving Forward

 
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Old March 29th, 2010 Mar 29, 2010 7:12:12 AM -   #1 (permalink)
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Default Moving Forward

I know this thread will likely get flamed. I believe myself to be a reasonable person. The DIY DTG forum has received allot of interest. The original basis for this has been on the C88 printer plans that were originally presented and the corresponding video on Youtube.

The C88 will never be practical for commercial purposes. Building printers on older Epsons is not practical because parts and availability will create problems for any serious business model. I know that some insist that we must use the Epson 2200 to be successful but even as I write this, one would be pressed to find one on Ebay.

For this reason I am suggesting the Workforce 1100 is the best basic printer to begin with. It has five colors... 2 black and C-Y-M. This actually lays down a serious amount of black for boldness... There are problems with this printer. I can however get it to print with Gimp and Gutenprint. So, it is viable.

For printing on dark shirts I would suggest the R1900. It has sufficient additional layers to lay down enough white on one pass. That's two passes understand. The second pass would be to lay down your color. Some have stated issues with the 1900 but I suspect (I haven't built one) that it suffers the same problems as the Workforce 1100. If so, it should print with Gimp and Gutenprint.

I am at a loss how to only print to the white channels in Gutenprint. Someone has suggested it can be done with open source software but I have yet to discover this process. You would therefore have to purchase a RIP to accomplish this. To the best of my knowlege Multirip GP is the cheapest RIP that will will print white channels and work with the 1900.

You could of course use the 1400 (still haven't built one) but the usefulness for printing white layers is limited... You would have to print two passes of white and the CYMK pass afterwards... Three passes in any workflow would be a waste of time IMHO not to mention registration issues....

It is for this reason I suggest steering this forum toward the hacking of the Workforce 1100 and the R1900. We should do so until Epson makes these models obsolete. There is plenty of information concerning building the C88 so we don't need to focus development there.

Thanks,

Bob ?;O)
 
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Old March 29th, 2010 Mar 29, 2010 7:19:40 AM -   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Moving Forward

Quote:
Originally Posted by colorfinger
You could of course use the 1400 (still haven't built one) but the usefulness for printing white layers is limited... You would have to print two passes of white and the CYMK pass afterwards... Three passes in any workflow would be a waste of time IMHO not to mention registration issues....
Bob,

Although no dtg manufacturer has asked for a 1400 dtg RIP to be made from us, I am not totally sure that two passes on the 1400 printer for the white underbase will satisfy everyone. The 1400 print head does use slightly different dot sizes than the 1800 / 1900 printers. So it is a lot like the Epson 2200 printer where some people think that one pass using 3 ink channels at 1440 x 1440 does a good enough job and others say you have to run two passes at 1440 x 720 to get a good underbase. Until a dtg manufacturer actually comes out with one running white ink and I can see it, I am going to hold back judgment either way.

I am not arguing with your logic by the way. Just more of an FYI in case others want to try the 1400 printer. Best wishes with your ongoing project.

Mark
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Old March 29th, 2010 Mar 29, 2010 9:50:45 AM -   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Moving Forward

Thanks Mark... I agree that it is not the best candidate.

Bob
 
 
Old March 29th, 2010 Mar 29, 2010 11:15:51 AM -   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Moving Forward

Doh, So when my 1400 gets here this week I should not even open it and sell it?

Dont matter to me just so long as we can make a 1900 work.
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Old March 29th, 2010 Mar 29, 2010 11:27:30 AM -   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Moving Forward

Dennis,

I believe the 1900 will work with Multirip GP very predictably. I believe it should deal with the sensor issues plaguing the 1100. I have not built one yet but I suspect this is the case. Mark, Have you tried the R1900 DIY DTG with Multirip GP? Is my assumption correct?

The 1400 is a great printer for making wide format separations if you are doing silk screening. It also prints to transfers nicely. There are other threads discussing this... I believe Inkfly sells the transfer ink and paper.

Bob ?;O)

Last edited by colorfinger; March 29th, 2010 at 02:54 PM..
 
Old March 29th, 2010 Mar 29, 2010 4:26:24 PM -   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Moving Forward

i was just looking over the 1100 manual and on page 22 chapter 2 operating principles i noticed a caption that said the 1100 has the same basic mechanism as the r1900. anybody with any exp with the r1900 that can elaborate on that, or does anyone have the service manual they would be willing to part with? i know my mod would work with this but im just curious as to the chasis if it has the same measurements as the 1100? if that were the case it would be wonderful as far as using my same drive platen system design without any alterations. also i understand it would need rip software from what i have read here any suggestions with that and cost? after reading what colorfinger and daguide have explained i think it would be superior as far as white printing goes compared to the 1400 im i reading that right?

i,m was looking on epson site and the 1100 and r1900 look remarkably similar even there placement of buttons. just hope chasis is the same size?

Last edited by german13; March 29th, 2010 at 05:05 PM..
 
Old March 29th, 2010 Mar 29, 2010 5:02:23 PM -   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Moving Forward

Just bought a 1900 off Ebay that they claim it has a paper jam issue. I figure for $130 it could turn out to be a good deal.
Now to find some carts to get it going.
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Old March 29th, 2010 Mar 29, 2010 5:18:23 PM -   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Moving Forward

The 1900 is exactly the same as the 1100. I do have the service manual and will compare the two just for grins and giggles but I'm pretty sure... even more than the 1400.

From what I've been told the 1900 will print with Multirip. The software speaks to the printer and overcomes the initialization stage. You can try the demo and make sure... I can say nothing for sure until I perform it.

On the practical side Multirip will not print with the 1100 or the 1400. It has a price tag of $800 which, believe me, is less expensive than competing products.

This is why I have no problem spending $400 on German's controller as long as it helps me get a good working product. My mod aims at taking the load off the motor so to make it last as long as possible.

If all is working well it will just spit out T's as long as I perform maintenance on the print head regularly. Eventually, my $150 Workforce will die and I will simply replace it.... But everything will be in place for a quick mod!

Bob ?;O)
 
Old March 29th, 2010 Mar 29, 2010 5:41:41 PM -   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Moving Forward

hey bob

i would really appreciate a copy of that 1900 service manual in a pdf if you could spare it?

additionally would there be an open source software or is rip necessary for controlling the ink channels?

also for anyone interested in direct driving there unit stock drive products/sterling instrument has some great stuff they also have machining capability Mechanical Components Timing Belts Pulleys Spur Gears Pulley Couplings Bearings Brakes Gear Clutches Shafts Shaftloc Sprockets Retaining Rings Fairloc ConiDrive Manufacturing

Last edited by german13; March 29th, 2010 at 06:21 PM..
 
Old March 29th, 2010 Mar 29, 2010 7:09:04 PM -   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Moving Forward

Quote:
Originally Posted by german13
additionally would there be an open source software or is rip necessary for controlling the ink channels?
Yes, you do need a RIP. I am not aware of any open source software that will allow you to control which ink channels will be fired based on an artwork design... let alone creating the white underbase layer, printing it at a specific resolution, being able to choke the pixels to address the issue of ink spreading due to the amount being applied and adjusting for any offset based on the printer's need. It is important to understand that just any RIP will not provide the needs that a dtg owner will need depending on the Epson printer that is being used. So many people under-estimate the amount of time and effort that goes into a dtg RIP. The code that is used by the dtg RIPs is specialize and has took over 4 years to get to where it is today. (Sorry, I am very proud of MultiRIP GP and appreciate the work that has gone into it).

Mark
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Old March 29th, 2010 Mar 29, 2010 7:18:32 PM -   #11 (permalink)
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Default Re: Moving Forward

German,

I had to purchase it and it is a copyrighted product so I don't think I can just give it out. ?;O)

I haven't found any open source solution. I believe there are many benefits to using Multirip however. It is a well thought out product. If I find a solution I will let everyone know in the "RIP Software Options" thread...

https://www.t-shirtforums.com/diy-dtg/t80712.html

Bob ?;O)
 
Old March 29th, 2010 Mar 29, 2010 7:21:07 PM -   #12 (permalink)
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Default Re: Moving Forward

Mark
thanks for the info. it will be a bit before i tear into one of these, once i get the 1100 operating at 100%, the 1900 will be my next digg. i also have to confirm this unit has the same measurements as the 1100 to fit my design. at that point i,ll get with you for rip purchase.
 
Old March 29th, 2010 Mar 29, 2010 7:23:42 PM -   #13 (permalink)
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Default Re: Moving Forward

thanks bob
ill just get a copy where i got the 1100 manual from!
 
Old March 30th, 2010 Mar 30, 2010 8:08:48 AM -   #14 (permalink)
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Default Re: Moving Forward

after reviewing the two manuals 1100-1900 they look to be the same, all the schematics are the same with the exception of the cdr sensor which is a mechanical contact type. no different than the cover open sensor which is easily disabled. i would assume that the chasis is the same as well i figure it would be cost effective in that sense for there production, i dont see them using to separate chasis but im unsure as of yet. i didnt see any measurements and didnt expect to either.

anyone have a 1900 broken down that could give me some measurements outside to outside length including the feet and front to back width. a measurement of the docking station area would be great also preferably in inches. at the epson store the 1900 is 399.00 they have a 150.00 mail in rebate, hate to drop the four bills for measurements if its not the same.

the 1100 measures 22 3/4 length....4 7/8 width docking station area 4 3/4 length to inside metal edge including the right outside foot (just chasis excluding electronics)

thanks jeff

Last edited by german13; March 30th, 2010 at 08:40 AM..
 
Old March 30th, 2010 Mar 30, 2010 8:57:04 AM -   #15 (permalink)
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Default Re: Moving Forward

Quote:
Originally Posted by colorfinger
German,

I had to purchase it and it is a copyrighted product so I don't think I can just give it out. ?;O)



Bob ?;O)
I have found them on share sites but you have to join. Dont know about trusting that.
Always leary of a virus.
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