I've been playing with discharge and really like it and see a lot of potential with it. How do you guys deal with the fumes? I'm expecting my Hix 24" 10' oven to arrive this week and I can run a vent line from the oven outdoors, but the landlord of my warehouse doesn't want me doing stuff with fumes that will bother the neighbors, so I may have to talk him into it. It's a tricky situation.
How much fume will be created discharging, say, 60 shirts an hour with an oven? How do you handle it at your shop? Face mask? Respirator? Venting from the oven out of the shop? Thanks in advance.
I've been playing with discharge and really like it and see a lot of potential with it. How do you guys deal with the fumes? I'm expecting my Hix 24" 10' oven to arrive this week and I can run a vent line from the oven outdoors, but the landlord of my warehouse doesn't want me doing stuff with fumes that will bother the neighbors, so I may have to talk him into it. It's a tricky situation.
How much fume will be created discharging, say, 60 shirts an hour with an oven? How do you handle it at your shop? Face mask? Respirator? Venting from the oven out of the shop? Thanks in advance.
I am assuming that you mean "discharge" as in removing color from a dark colored shirt?
I only question that 'cause I am not sure at this point what is the right name for everything. heh
I read on Dharma.com that they feel it is fine to use this stuff, it is not harmful if you go by their guidelines...
I have read on a LOT of other places that it is one of the most poisonous things there is, and that it can do a lot of damage.
I really don't know who's right, all I know is that now, I am slightly apprehensive about it all, 'cause discharging is what I was kind'a interested in.
Reading about the chemicals it contains, "Sodium Thiosulfate" it can be safe, but hearing experiences from (supposed) seasoned t-shirt makers I read on the internet, I can't say who's saying what.
All I know is that a really nice way of getting a cool look has put on hold for me right now, it scared me enough to keep on doing more research on it until I feel it's safe enough to do.
From what I read a certain type of respirator, doing it outdoors only, and try to take every precaution you can with it.
I read the same about using bleach to make it white, then vinegar to stop the bleach from doing it's job.
The vinegar does stop the bleach, but the chemical it makes is poisonous, and is considered dangerous enough that where I read these things most didn't use it.
(I wish I had kept links to those places, I had no idea I would read anyone asking this... )
I did read that if you used a watered down version of bleach, and a watered down version of vinegar, it would not be as lethal.
(Supposedly, I don't know, I'm only telling what I read, and how true any of this is, I don't know)
You may know all of this already, I am only saying this 'cause I'd be evil if I didn't mention it and you did it with bad results.
I'd bet the Dharma stuff is more for home-use, the industrial type stuff has formaldehyde and some other nasty stuff, i'm sure.
Do you think the fumes will be that bad once they get out in the open? I doubt it myself, but I've never messed w/ discharge so I've never smelled it.
If possible, vent it thru the roof, next best thing I guess would be run your ductwork outside to the roofline.
I worked with James from Hix when I helped my ink vendor at the ISS show a few weeks ago, that dude knows a ton about dryers and I can tell you they make a nice one, you'll love it, I'll probably get one once I outgrow mine.
Brent, I have a Hix 2410 dryer as well and I haven't had any problems with discharge fumes. Before I got into discharge printing, I kept hearing scary stories about formaldehyde fumes poisoning everything in its path and rotten egg smells taking over the shop. Maybe that is true for some brands but I have not had any problems what so ever. I can't smell anything, and I haven't passed out yet, that I know of. I use Union's discharge and they actually put a bubble gum smell into their additive and maybe that helps but I can't even smell that once I run it through the dryer.
I wouldn't worry about it. Good luck.
I am wondering what you do to stop the discharge process then?
I haven't done any of it, I only know what I read, and some of that might not be good information.
Do you have a certain process that you go through (without giving out any secrets) so I (we) that like the idea of discharging won't buy the wrong stuff?
I really do like the discharge look, but I am really apprehensive about buying stuff I'm unsure about.
I am wondering what you do to stop the discharge process then?
Do you have a certain process that you go through (without giving out any secrets) so I (we) that like the idea of discharging won't buy the wrong stuff?
I am not sure what you mean by " What do you do to stop the discharge process." When you run your print through the dryer, the heat of the dryer causes a chemical reaction and causes the water based additives to evaporate and like magic you have a discharged print which is just the "bleaching" of the fiber reactive dye.
I don't think there are any secrets to discharge printing. It is a relatively easy process. Adding pigments can be a little trickier just because the discharge additives will sometimes wash out your color, especially in reds and oranges and that can be frustrating. Thanks to a respected member Fluid, I was able to work around that by just using water based inks over a discharge base.
The only thing you will definitely need other than the obvious chemicals is a lot of heat. Your going to need a hot dryer with a variable belt speed.
I have only used Union products for discharge, but I have heard good things about Matsui and Wiflex as well. Contact the sales reps and they will tell you what you need.
It will take some experimenting but don't be nervous to try it out.
I am not sure what you mean by " What do you do to stop the discharge process."
Ohhhh, I get it now, I was going by what I had read on Dhama's site, they do the 'wet' way, then it has to be stopped to keep the chemical reaction from continuing.
I'll definitely have to look into your way you describe, that is the first I heard of that.
Thank you for taking the time to explain this to me, I do appreciate that.
I've done more discharge printing with Matsui discharge (great stuff), and there is some odor. I really want to get into it now and do larger runs, but after smelling some odor from small test runs, I'm concerned that it might be really strong during a big run (like 165 discharge prints that someone is talking about having me print).
My landlord said I can't make fumes. So now I'm thinking that I want a way to internally remove the odor. Does anyone know about some sort of air cleaner that I could run my oven exhaust into, that would remove the odor using charcoal or something, then it could just expel into my large shop, stink-free?
The problem with discharge fumes is that the shirt needs to be in the dryer longer than plastisol. A well vented dryer doesn't get all of the fumes so we use scents to make it smell better. At last check, they have pine, lemon, and bubble gum scents to add to the ink to make it smell better. Check with your salesman to find out as we haven't bought any in years.
i use a gas dryer. the convection action takes the discharge fumes and run them through a 220,000btu burner several times. both ends of the oven are hooded and power vented. all vents are 16' high so that i never smell a thing even when doing burn-outs. i've replaced my entire shop with water base friendly equipment and it has opened up a lot of possibilities to me. some say this is a fad, what do you think? stan
we do discharge printing just about everyday and in large bulk quantities. we have on one side two manuals and an automatic that feed shirts into a dryer. on the other side we have two more automatics that feed even more shirts into a second dryer. yes discharge smells like farts. i hate it. when the shirts are passing through the dryer it's a little smokey because the discharge is doing it's job. the ink will not discharge properly until it has been passed through the dryer and there is specifics about that. yes, there is formaldehyde in discharge. no, no one has died yet. is discharge a fad? not at all. discharge is a waterbased ink, and waterbased inks have a different print than plastisol. soft and light.
everybody is worred about the effects of discharge to their body's. the effects of plastisol ink on the earth are 10 times more deadly. waterbased inks can be more earth-friendly.
I prefer to use Permaset Supercover. Discharge isn't eco-friendly so I found this to be my only option. There is a trade off though. The Supercover doesn't have as soft of a handle as discharge.
yes, there is formaldehyde in discharge. no, no one has died yet. is discharge a fad? not at all. discharge is a waterbased ink, and waterbased inks have a different print than plastisol. soft and light.
everybody is worred about the effects of discharge to their body's. the effects of plastisol ink on the earth are 10 times more deadly. waterbased inks can be more earth-friendly.
I don't use discharge, so I'm not familiar with the product contents. It sounds like there are a lot of products with different contents.
I would like to say, please be careful if you use a product with formaldehyde - it isn't damaging to the environment, but it is a potent carcinogen. It won't make you pass out and it will take many years before you know if it kills you.
If there are a lot of types of discharge, it might be a good idea to check the chemical make-up of each and avoid any products using formaldehyde (if possible). That may help cut down on fumes as well.
I don't use discharge, so I'm not familiar with the product contents. It sounds like there are a lot of products with different contents.
I would like to say, please be careful if you use a product with formaldehyde - it isn't damaging to the environment, but it is a potent carcinogen. It won't make you pass out and it will take many years before you know if it kills you.
If there are a lot of types of discharge, it might be a good idea to check the chemical make-up of each and avoid any products using formaldehyde (if possible). That may help cut down on fumes as well.
Funny how a thread lives on after a few years.
I want to answer this concern about discharge having formaldehyde. Since any new readers may become confused.
Discharge does not contain formaldehyde. It contains a chemical compound called ZFS which has as part of it's makeup formaldehyde. But this chemical compound is NOT formaldehyde and is not a carcinogenic, it does not cause cancer.
Let me explain my answer. Florine is extremely dangerous, but as fluoride, we use it in our toothpaste and in our drinking water. The difference is fluoride is a compound. The same is true between formaldehyde and ZFS.
Regarding fumes, always take precautions when working with chemicals. Use gloves, and always have plenty of ventilation.
I hope that clears up any misunderstandings.
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The active agent in discharge inks is Zinc Formaldehyde Sulfoxylate (ZFS). This is not remotely the same thing as formaldehyde. It is a different compound. From everything that I have read, there are only trace amounts of actual formaldehyde created in the discharge process. Pure oxygen is toxic to the human body, yet oxygen is part of nearly everything that enters our body. People freak out when they hear formaldehyde, when it is not much of a risk factor at all. You should be more afraid of your spot gun chemicals that you may use a gallon or two of a year, than you should be of the hundreds or thousands of gallons of discharge ink that you go through a year.
Dealing with discharge fumes 
Re: Dealing with discharge fumes 
