I have been talking to a couple distributors about changing my inks up a bit to get a soft hand feel for my own line. Union Plasticharge and Wilflex Fashion Base have both been recommended to me. I am thinking of getting the Union Mixo Kit with the plasticharge or the Wilflex Fashion Soft Base system. The sales staff have both given me their pitches on the inks and now I am wanting to hear some opinions from the people who actually use them.
Is one easier to use than the other? Wilflex uses pigments which I am not used to but sales said that it is very easy to mix and achieve desired pantone colors. Has anyone had trouble with their mixing system? I have been told that the Wilflex Fashion base will have a softer hand than the Union Plasticharge. Is this true? Which do you recommend?
Any opinions? Thanks.
Re: Union Plasticharge VS. Wilflex Fashion Soft Base?
These are two different mediums.
We use both The Wilflex Fashion Soft as well as the Wilflex NF Discharge. If your wanting to get the soft hand on dark t's and use the Fashion Soft base you'll still need to discharge as an underbase or the normal underbase will defeat the purpose of the soft hand
Re: Union Plasticharge VS. Wilflex Fashion Soft Base?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fluid
These are two different mediums.
We use both The Wilflex Fashion Soft as well as the Wilflex NF Discharge. If your wanting to get the soft hand on dark t's and use the Fashion Soft base you'll still need to discharge as an underbase or the normal underbase will defeat the purpose of the soft hand
Have you found that using the Wilflex Fashion soft and the NF discharge together gives you similar results to water based discharge with minimal hand? Since I am a new-B to the system, I am worried about their mixing system. Is there mixing system pretty easy or does mixing the pigments take some time to get used to? Are there any problems you encountered when you began using the inks with discharge?
Re: Union Plasticharge VS. Wilflex Fashion Soft Base?
the NF discharge is waterbased and printing the fashion soft over will yield a soft print. After the first wash it is like waterbased. Before the wash there is a hand yet nothing like regular plasticols.
Mixing pigments with the discharge is not 100% accurate. The raw cotton is actually a natural color. Adding pigments to discharge bases is like printing waterbased inks on a natural t. the inks are super transparent and the natural color of the raw cotton will change the hue/shade of the ink.
Yellow added to discharge printed on a black t's resulted in a slightly greenish hue to the yellow ink.
I am happy with the outcome thus far yet make sure all clients know the colors will not be 100% exact.
Re: Union Plasticharge VS. Wilflex Fashion Soft Base?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fluid
the NF discharge is waterbased and printing the fashion soft over will yield a soft print. After the first wash it is like waterbased. Before the wash there is a hand yet nothing like regular plasticols.
Mixing pigments with the discharge is not 100% accurate. The raw cotton is actually a natural color. Adding pigments to discharge bases is like printing water based inks on a natural t. the inks are super transparent and the natural color of the raw cotton will change the hue/shade of the ink.
Yellow added to discharge printed on a black T's resulted in a slightly greenish hue to the yellow ink.
I am happy with the outcome thus far yet make sure all clients know the colors will not be 100% exact.
Fluid, have you ever used the NF Discharge Super White? I am wondering if this would give you a good white base and allow for more consistency in color when using the Fashion Soft Base. If you have done this, did it leave a heavier hand?
Also what mesh are you using for the discharge and the Fashion Soft Base.
I just spoke with the California rep for Wilflex and she admitted that she is very green to inks and unfortunately does not know anything about the discharge system or the Fashion soft base inks so I hope you don't mind me picking your brain a bit. Thanks.
Re: Union Plasticharge VS. Wilflex Fashion Soft Base?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fluid
Yes we do. Will be printing the t-shirt forums shirts this way for Rodney.
How do you cure your prints currently? Discharge needs serious heat and duration of exposure to activate the discharge agent.
I cure my inks using a Hix 2410 dryer. It has a three panel heating element that is about 8' long. I know you need a large dryer for the discharge and I am not sure if the 2410 is large enough.
Re: Union Plasticharge VS. Wilflex Fashion Soft Base?
Should be you will just need to crank up the temp and lower the belt speed to a crawl. We flash our prints with a quartz flash and run through our gas dryer at 400+ temp and lower the belt speed considerably to ensure a proper discharge.
Its tough at first to get all the parameters correct, yet once you do its a sinch and great process. Minus the smell
Re: Union Plasticharge VS. Wilflex Fashion Soft Base?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fluid
These are two different mediums.
We use both The Wilflex Fashion Soft as well as the Wilflex NF Discharge. If your wanting to get the soft hand on dark t's and use the Fashion Soft base you'll still need to discharge as an underbase or the normal underbase will defeat the purpose of the soft hand
Hey,
If you discharge the underbase, do you need to fully cure it before using the fashion soft base over it?
Can you flash cure, then print the fashion base over top, then fully cure in a conveyor drier, or is this gonna mess with the discharge portion.
Re: Union Plasticharge VS. Wilflex Fashion Soft Base?
Derek,
Thank you for your interest in Wilflex Fashion Soft Base. As Richard stated Fashion Soft Base is a specailty base designed to simulate a waterbased print. It is very low in viscosity and opacity. You can use all three of the Wilflex Mixing Systems with Fashion Soft Base to pigment the base. For example you can use MX - which is a finished ink mixing system - to Fashion Soft Base at a rate of 25% by weight. This will give you a bit more opacity and a bit more hand, but it will still be really soft. If you decide to use the PC Express system - which is a pigment concentrate and base system - you need to use the Wilflex Ink Room Management Software (IMS) to ensure that your finished ink is balanced. (meaning that the ratio of resin and plastizer are in balance). You can also use the Equalizer mixing system with Fashion Soft Base. This technique is really popular.
Anyway, Fashion Soft Base works very well on light colored garments, but does not have the opacity for printing on dark colored garments. So as Richard suggested, discharging out an underbase is a great option.
I have attached the Product Information Bulletin for Fashion Soft Base, NF Plascharge (similar to unions plasticharge), NF Discharge Base, and NF Activator.
I have also attached tips on how to complete a Plascharge Fashion Soft Technique.
If you have any quesitons, you can always contact Wilflex Technical Services by either emailing or calling 800-326-0226 and hitting 1.
Re: Union Plasticharge VS. Wilflex Fashion Soft Base?
Quote:
Originally Posted by ErinAllen
Derek,
Thank you for your interest in Wilflex Fashion Soft Base. As Richard stated Fashion Soft Base is a specailty base designed to simulate a waterbased print. It is very low in viscosity and opacity. You can use all three of the Wilflex Mixing Systems with Fashion Soft Base to pigment the base. For example you can use MX - which is a finished ink mixing system - to Fashion Soft Base at a rate of 25% by weight. This will give you a bit more opacity and a bit more hand, but it will still be really soft. If you decide to use the PC Express system - which is a pigment concentrate and base system - you need to use the Wilflex Ink Room Management Software (IMS) to ensure that your finished ink is balanced. (meaning that the ratio of resin and plastizer are in balance). You can also use the Equalizer mixing system with Fashion Soft Base. This technique is really popular.
Anyway, Fashion Soft Base works very well on light colored garments, but does not have the opacity for printing on dark colored garments. So as Richard suggested, discharging out an underbase is a great option.
I have attached the Product Information Bulletin for Fashion Soft Base, NF Plascharge (similar to unions plasticharge), NF Discharge Base, and NF Activator.
I have also attached tips on how to complete a Plascharge Fashion Soft Technique.
If you have any quesitons, you can always contact Wilflex Technical Services by either emailing or calling 800-326-0226 and hitting 1.
I hope that helps!
Erin
Hello Erin,
I just posted this question, but perhaps you can help me.
Hey,
If you discharge the underbase, do you need to fully cure it before using the fashion soft base over it?
walkthrough of what i want to achieve -
black t-shirt, 4 bright vibrant colours, registered.
can i discharge underlay the entire print, then proceed to use plastisol with the fashion additive on top this underbase, with only a flash cure?
my impression is that if i have to remove the t-shirt from the platen, cure it fully in a conveyor dryer, then put it back on the platen to overprint in the other colours, then I would never be able to achieve exact registration (well I would, but it would take much longer than wanted).
So my question to you -
Does the t-shirt have to leave the platen at all in between the discharge underbasing and the fashion-plastisol-colour-overprinting?
Re: Union Plasticharge VS. Wilflex Fashion Soft Base?
Quote:
Originally Posted by nsallo12345
Hello Erin,
I just posted this question, but perhaps you can help me.
Hey,
If you discharge the underbase, do you need to fully cure it before using the fashion soft base over it?
walkthrough of what i want to achieve -
black t-shirt, 4 bright vibrant colours, registered.
can i discharge underlay the entire print, then proceed to use plastisol with the fashion additive on top this underbase, with only a flash cure?
my impression is that if i have to remove the t-shirt from the platen, cure it fully in a conveyor dryer, then put it back on the platen to overprint in the other colours, then I would never be able to achieve exact registration (well I would, but it would take much longer than wanted).
So my question to you -
Does the t-shirt have to leave the platen at all in between the discharge underbasing and the fashion-plastisol-colour-overprinting?
Sorry for not responding to this question in my previous email. You do not have to fully cure the discharge underbase before you print the plastisol on top of it. We do recommend flashing it to get some of the water out of the underbase and so that you can see the underbase to register it.
The product is actually Fashion Soft Base. It is considered to be a special effects base, not an additive.
Re: Union Plasticharge VS. Wilflex Fashion Soft Base?
Quote:
Originally Posted by ErinAllen
Sorry for not responding to this question in my previous email. You do not have to fully cure the discharge underbase before you print the plastisol on top of it. We do recommend flashing it to get some of the water out of the underbase and so that you can see the underbase to register it.
The product is actually Fashion Soft Base. It is considered to be a special effects base, not an additive.
I hope that helps.
Erin
It does help.
Right also about the special effects base. I've actually ordered some of it just recently!
So Say i was doing a two colour print on a black tee -
three screens
1) discharge underbase
2&3) colours with fashion base (this base is added to plastisols to get the bright look, but the fashion feel correct?)
pull the discharge base, cure for how long you recommend? and under what type of flash curer? (i know the best reccomended flash drier is a forced air flash for water-based/discharge, but in the instance mentioned i.e. discharge underbase w/ overprint plastisol, would a regular flash curer do the trick, followed by full curing in a conveyor drier? we have a conveyor drier more than capable of fully curing discharge, just trying to keep it on platen to maintain crisp registration and maximize time).
Thanks again, you've already been a good help to me!
Union Plasticharge VS. Wilflex Fashion Soft Base? 
