doleboy

i'm experimenting with wilflex's fashion soft base and their equalizer color matching system, but my prints are fading...

the process:
i mixed 10% equalizer black with 90% fashion soft base to make a nice "liquidy" black ink. as well, i pantone matched a green hue using fashion soft base instead of amazing base. both colors were printed through 230 mesh onto a white AA tee and cured with an IR dryer. the minimum cure temp of 320 was definitely met. plus, i always set my belt speed slow to ensure the entire ink film reaches temp.

problems:
both colors printed great initially. they looked and felt amazing after the cure too. but the problem is that both colors faded after one wash. the black looks charcoal gray now and the green is completely dull. another one of the shirts that i have worn a few times, but not washed yet, is also faded when compared to an unworn shirt i kept for reference. but it's not as bad as the washed shirt.

i don't think my problem is curing, since i was checking the exit temperature form my dryer. is my problem fibrillation? it does look like there are small fibers popping through the print making it look dull and gray. if it's fibrillation, what can i do to prevent this? am i using too much fashion soft base? should i mix my colors with amazing base to make a standard plastisol and then mix that finished plastisol 25%/75% with the fashion soft base? (even though wilflex's documentation seems to indicate that i can use the fashion soft base directly in their pantone formulas with the equalizer kit)

any help would be appreciated
thanks in advance

 

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thutch15

I would not think you would need to add anything to the black, due to the fact that most blacks are so smooth to begin with.

 

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doleboy

Quote: Originally Posted by thutch15 I would not think you would need to add anything to the black, due to the fact that most blacks are so smooth to begin with.

the "black" is one to the various equalizers used in the pantone matching system. therefore it's a pigment that needs to be added to a base; in this case i was using fashion soft base as the base and mixed it 10% black equalizer/90% FSB as per the wilflex technical literature.

just a little more info: wetting the shirt makes the colors more vibrant; i assume this confirms it is fibrillation.

i guess the question now is how to get rid of it. i've read a lot of posts on this forum about fibrillation, but there seems to be a lot of conflicting advice and mixed info. what makes sense to me however would be putting down a clear under base to matte down the fibers - but this seems like it would defeat the purpose of using the soft hand base...

the second bit of advice i read was applying just enough pressure to lay the ink on the surface of the shirt. this is how i normally print with regular plastisol. but the wilflex FSB tech info said to "Use a print stroke that allows the ink to fully penetrate the surface of the fabric" i.e. push hard

with that said, the FSB mixed ink is so thin and watery, it's not like it will matt down the fibers like normal thick plastisol... therefore maybe if i push harder and drive it through the garment more, it will coat the fibers fully so when they do stand up, they'll still be colored on all surfaces? just thinking out loud here

 

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TshirtGuru

The unfortunate part of soft hand plastisol is that you will get fibers showing through after a wash. Either use waterbased inks or discharge if you really need softer inks without fibers.

You can also try using less of the fashion additive which will help the ink cover the fibers but you of course won't have as soft of a print.

 

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doleboy

Quote: Originally Posted by TshirtGuru The unfortunate part of soft hand plastisol is that you will get fibers showing through after a wash. Either use waterbased inks or discharge if you really need softer inks without fibers. You can also try using less of the fashion additive which will help the ink cover the fibers but you of course won't have as soft of a print.

eh, i was afraid of this...
discharge on white wouldn;t make sense so i assume waterbase dinks are my only option then.

as for discharge on darks: i have wilflex's 50/50 plascharge system - i messed around with it but couldn't get a nice white; it would always come out a light brown. tried with multiple shirt stocks as well with similar results.

i might just say screw it and start printing waterbased but this is a whole new breed that i haven't properly researched yet. ughhh

 

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studog79

Call Erin at Wilflex tech. She will help you out. She's also on here checking things out. We have used the fashion soft base with no bad issues. I will discuss this with our printers tomorrow to see if they know but Erin would help.

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tpitman

Quote: Originally Posted by doleboy as for discharge on darks: i have wilflex's 50/50 plascharge system - i messed around with it but couldn't get a nice white; it would always come out a light brown. tried with multiple shirt stocks as well with similar results.

I've got Union Ink's Plasticharge White and Plasticharge Additive, which is just the clear base. The White is actually designed for use as an underbase, and, depending on the brand of shirt, prints sort of tannish or a very pale tan. I just did a test job using the plasticharge additive, mixed it 50/50 with Union Bright Cotton White and 6% ZFS activator, and that white is brilliant. A very slight stiffness to the material right after printing, but I washed the shirt and you can't feel anything. Same with the second color on that print, which was yellow. Used some high-opacity J&S ink I had and it's really bright. Printed on a Hanes Tagless, Black, which I've found produces the brightest job. On the front was a red imprint, and I had to add a little more plastisol to the mix above the 50/50 to get a deeper red, but it looks good. Red is one of the problematic colors doing discharge. I used QCM XOLB Bright Red, which I'd seen mentioned on another board as being a good red to use with discharge.

 

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