I know i have posted a similar thread already but i thought i would repost with a more detailed question and concern, so here goes:-
Hi,
thanks for your feedbacks. To be honest I must be really thick because I still dont have a clue as to what ink to use.
Let me give you a breakdown of what i want to do and use.
Heat press
t-shirts, mugs, plates, clocks ect
use light and dark transfer paper
bubble jet printer (epson d88, r265 or r300)
what ink do i use? I am realy confused, do i use pigment ink, sublimation ink dye, artanium? I have got the drift of everything else but not this. Seems like there are so many types of inks but all i want is one that will do all (if this is possible) i need to do and that will not wash off or run in the wash. Ok i know that in time it will fade away but not after a few washes. I have been told that ink dye works for both light and dark transfers, pigment ink is the way to go, artanium is the right option and even some other names that i cant think of now.
Can anyone help or advise mere, or better still let me know where to go. I really dont want to buy the wrong ink and printer and sell bad quality cheap goods.
LOL, I have been researching here for at least two months. Here is my understanding and hopefully someone will make corrections as necessary
You will need two systems if you plan on sublimating plates, mugs etc and printing transfers
Epson C120, 1280, 1400 etc will work.
One system will have sublimation inks in it which you can use to make polyester tee shirts and sublimating mugs and other items. I believe artainium is a sublimation ink done by conde (dyetrans.com)
The second system would have a pigment ink such as Armur which is a lot less expensive than the sublimation ink. This would be used with your transfer papers.
Amor
Artanium ink is a brand of dye sublimation ink.If you want to do cotton shirts dye sub isnt your answer.For all the rest you want to do id say dye sub for sure
I do not know much about mugs but inks and transfer. It is correct that dye-based ink is not really the way to go if you want to produce sharp images and a long lasting product.
Long lasting however is also a matter of ink and not only the coating of the paper. Therefore pigment is the right way. What pigment ink you are going to use is basically up to what and how you compare the various brands. There are pigment inks without binders and in that case the durability of the end product comes solely from the quality of the paper coating. G The combination of both gives the end product a high vivid and durability.
Jan
Last edited by Rodney; February 26th, 2008 at 11:15 AM.
Reason: removed self promotion as per forum rules
Just dont confuse dye ink with dye sublimation ink as they are two totally separate types of ink.Use pigment for cotton,many different brands.Suggest sublimation ink.although pricey,much more durable and vibrant colors on mugs ang such.Also with sublimation ink on light colored polyester shirts the ink is dyed into the shirts so all you feel is the shirt,no hand,vibrant colors,no peeling,cracking,fading.only a few brands of dye sub ink out there excluding ink from china.
I do not know much about mugs but inks and transfer. It is correct that dye-based ink is not really the way to go if you want to produce sharp images and a long lasting product.
Long lasting however is also a matter of ink and not only the coating of the paper. Therefore pigment is the right way. What pigment ink you are going to use is basically up to what and how you compare the various brands. There are pigment inks without binders and in that case the durability of the end product comes solely from the quality of the paper coating.
Jan
Could you do a review, much like others have done with JPSS and the such. Maybe with pictures too! It sounds like it might be a viable alternative to what every one else is using. I myself am always looking for the next best, economical solution whether it be paper or ink.
Last edited by Rodney; February 26th, 2008 at 11:15 AM.
Reason: cleanup
Just dont confuse dye ink with dye sublimation ink as they are two totally separate types of ink....
oneeyedjack
Sorry if it confused but I talked indeed about Dye-based inks solely used with the purpose of transfer to fibers. (no sublimation onto mugs etc.)
Many transfer papers claim (and in lot of cases correctly) they accept any type of inkjet ink (some even include laser toner) because the common printers are installed with dye based inks. If one wants to go that way because he/she just occasionally need to print on a t-shirt, for your own use or no need to sell it and have not a printer available dedicated for pigments you need to choose a paper with a very good coating. This however will have often other downsides e.g. such as a missing soft-hand, less wash and light fast, crocking, to much reside in unprinted areas and so on.
In addition even if one have a printer with pigments (there are even printers with a mixed (dye-base and pigment-based configuration) not all pigment inks contain the necessary binders. In that case again you need to look for a transfer paper with a very good formulated coating.
My point is that the best you can do is to combine both, ink with the containing binders and paper with a very good coating that gives you the soft-feel, no or a minimum reside etc. Once you have found that you can look at the prices you have to pay without going down in quality eventually to compare.
thanks forall your replies. i must admit i was confused but now that i have read this and spoken to someone on the who explained the different types of ink for different methods of transfer and sub. it now makes sense but i must admit, eventhough i work in a printers, this section really threw me out.
I have messed up and bought 100% cotton t-shirts but no problem, i know the methods now or at least i think i do.
However! I have seen and heard of a prep paper or spray that treats the cotton so that it can take sublimation and you get the same results but on a more comfortable top. Has anyone else heard or seen this? I would like to try this out as most of the interest gaines is on 100% cotton or other similar materials.
Boy, I am glad i asked this question, i now know allot more than i did yesterday.....
However! I have seen and heard of a prep paper or spray that treats the cotton so that it can take sublimation and you get the same results but on a more comfortable top. Has anyone else heard or seen this?
Hi Amor,
If you still have questions, please ask them. I know exactly how you feel. Everyone here was great about re-confirming for me as well, and still are.
I have heard of this pre-treatment. There is information out there in the threads on this. I haven't used it, but from reading the threads, it does not work good.
All of us would like to be able to have the expense of pigment ink, and the hand and self weeding of subdye. If there is a spray that works, we would all be using it.
If using cotton, dye ink is not good, do not use it, even the Claria by Espon. It washes out.
Armor,
there are pre-treatments and transfer media for dye-sublimation on cottons, but the results are far from perfect. Some may argue with that, but I wouldn't say you can get a retail quality product going this route.
I understand you are in the UK - if you haven't come across The Transfer Press before - check them out: there are a lot of blanks and consumables for dye-sub and heat transfer printing on their website and I believe they are very a helpful bunch of people if you have any questions about either process.
Seems like there are so many types of inks but all i want is one that will do all (if this is possible) i need to do and that will not wash off or run in the wash.
Sublimination dye will do all, the only catch is the shirts must be polyester.
Quote:
I have been told that ink dye works for both light and dark transfers,
Never use dye ink. It dissolves in water. No paper will stop that, thicker papers may slow the process, but dye will wash out.
Quote:
pigment ink is the way to go,
If going heat transfer paper and inkjet printers, yes, pigment.
There are laser printers with toners that are good to use, but they cost more than pigment and printer.
Deniseg is in the UK and she uses this method and she is very happy.
I will recommend for light shirts Jet Pro sofstretch and for darks Ironall dark. These papers stretch with the shirt instead of cracking and have excellent color retention. Jetpro barely has any hand, while Ironall darks is a little heavier, but not offensive. After you wash JP, the hand all but disappears.
If using cotton, dye ink is not good, do not use it, even the Claria by Espon. It washes out.
Best regards and good luck.
I was thinking more of durabrite by epson as it has pigment ink and as far as i am aware it is ideal for transfers. Durabrite is a pigment ink that is water resistant and will last some washes before fading. This is ideal as i can now sell the tshirts i have raising the money to by sublimation ink so that i can do propper sublimation printing.
I was thinking more of durabrite by epson as it has pigment ink and as far as i am aware it is ideal for transfers. Durabrite is a pigment ink that is water resistant and will last some washes before fading. This is ideal as i can now sell the tshirts i have raising the money to by sublimation ink so that i can do propper sublimation printing.
Please correct me if i am wrong....
You are right on the money. Pigment. The essence of pigment is it is encased in a resin/plastic that melts and adheres to the shirt. It is larger in size than dye because of it. No dye is good, meaning dye that is not sublimination dye.
Anther thing, in my experience, I have found 50/50 cotton/poly blends to hold pigment color better in the long run, and 100% cotton. You can do a search for 50/50 and 100% cotton, which is better. There are threads on the subject. Always get preshrunk. Prepress to remove moisture from your garments/substrates before pressing. A quick stretch prior to pressing seems to get everything set in just that much nicer. Use a good amount of pressure. You should be fine. Don't forget teflon or equivalent, I use teflon, keeps your fabric from scorching under the press while transferring the image. Good luck!
This ink business is giving me a head ache 
Re: This ink business is giving me a head ache 
