Okay so we've been toying around with the idea of getting a DTG printer. I've read posts on this forum regarding Fast T-Jet/T-Jet2, the goods/bads/uglies. Then I saw this printer DTG Kiosk - Digital Garment Printer. Anyone on here with some personal experience with this printer? It seems to be using the same modified Epson 2200, as with the T-jets. If they are in fact the same, how's this printer compare to the Fast T-Jet2, as far as quality? I've requested samples from Fast Tjet, but just curious to hear from someone on here. Thanks in advance.
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Last edited by Vtec44; December 28th, 2006 at 05:10 PM.
You are correct that they are using the same printer engine. There are some differences between the machines, the RIP software and possibly the inks depending on where you live. In the U.S., the country is split down the Mississippi River (SWF East has east of the river and SWF handles west of the river). I would recommend visiting the website (DTG America - Digital Garment Printers) and contact your sales rep. You might also want to check out the open forums for this machine at dtgequipmentusers.com or something similar to that). You really need to see any dtg in action in order to get a good feel for what they can really do. Any DTG machine has positive and negative things with them. If you know what they are and you plan around it, you will be very happy with them. DTG printing has not perfected the white ink printing. So be prepared to spend some time on working on this if you decide to go with a printer that has white ink. Don't forget about the other printers as well:
- Brother GT-541
- Flexi-Jet
- AnaJet
Rumor is that there are a couple of new machines right around the corner as well. The Long Beach ISS Show should be very interesting.
Last edited by Rodney; December 28th, 2006 at 05:48 PM.
Reason: delinked incorrect URL for now
I have the Kiosk and I think a few other forum members have it as well.
Overall it's a good design and makes printing and maintenance easier that some other DTG models. For example the waste ink bottle is located on the side which makes it easy to empty and a few other details. I would say call the folks at SWF Mesa or SWF East and they can give you more info about the printer itself. We were lucky enough to see a demo down here in Sacramento before we bought. We researched DTG printers for about 2 months before we saw some demos and decided on the Kiosk.
Another happy Kiosk owner. Great success printing on whites and light colors right out of the box with no experience or training. Like Mark said darks are a whole other story but the machine will do them...it's all about technique. Actually viewing some of Tahoes work on darks, "Folsom Foxes" shirt in particular, helped us to decide on the Kiosk.
Actually viewing some of Tahoes work on darks, "Folsom Foxes" shirt in particular, helped us to decide on the Kiosk.
I did a search and saw his shirts too. The only thing is that it may print and look great at first, but what about after 50 washes? We're doing mostly screen print and vinyl press now, and they're are awesome as far as durability. But, we're willing to give up a bit of quality for quick turn around time, especially on smaller orders. I'm also very interested in the pirnt quality on dark shirts.
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The best way to see the washing capability is to get samples so that you can wear them and wash them in the same manner as your customers would. Don't turn them inside-out and leave them in the washing machine for some time before transfering them to the dryer. Take some pictures under the same lighting settings and compare the results.
As far as printing white ink and washability, this depends tremendously on your ability to properly apply the pretreatment and cure the shirt. It sounds easy, but if you ask anyone that has tried to print white ink...IT IS AN ART! Don't let any of the sales rep tell you that it is easy to do a dtg print on darks. I have seen samples from almost every machine out there (Fast T-Jet, Kiosk, Flexi-Jet, Brother,...) and have seen the ink break down in the wash. I have also seen this happen by screen printing ink and heat applied vinyl.
On a side note, I feel sorry for you if your customers expectations are for the shirt to look the same as it was when they got the shirt as it does after 50 washes. That is simple unrealistic. Screen printing ink will crack within that time. Most vinyl will stretch and distort. Heat transfers will crack. The dye in the shirt will fade or change color. Dye sublimation is the longest lasting decorating technique that I know and you will see holes or other stains on the shirt that would change how you look at the shirt.
Screen printing ink will crack within that time. Most vinyl will stretch and distort. Heat transfers will crack.
I think properly applied screen printing ink will not crack after 50 washes. Some screen printed shirts will of course, but I have dozens of screen printed shirts that have been washed over 100 times with zero cracking.
I also have some that are cracked after the first wash (same with ink jet transfers and vinyl transfers). But I don't think it's the norm.
But I do get your point that a t-shirt design can realistically only be expected to last *so* long
I have seen samples from almost every machine out there (Fast T-Jet, Kiosk, Flexi-Jet, Brother,...) and have seen the ink break down in the wash.
this is the reason i was curious if printing adhesives are possible.
by printing an adhesive layer under the white would most likely make it more durable. Would it not ?
...still waiting for my free tester machine so that i can experiment too.
I think properly applied screen printing ink will not crack after 50 washes. Some screen printed shirts will of course, but I have dozens of screen printed shirts that have been washed over 100 times with zero cracking.
We do a lot of thermal vinyl for smaller runs, and the durrability is amazing. I wear a lot of vinyl "printed" shirts and they last for a very long time. I bought a few shirts from Zazzle and it's not even in the same league after just one wash. I'm anxiously waiting for my samples from Fast T-jet to compare. I enjoy the soft feel and quick setup time of a DTG printer though.
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What type of adhesive would you like to print on? Adhesive vinyl? Sure, several companies offer an printable vinyl that have heat applied adhesive on them. Now are you talking about printing from a dtg printer on to vinyl? Not sure why as the DTG inks are more expensive compared to standard pigment or dye base inks. However, I have talked to someone that has tried it on a "coated" (not sure what this means) vinyl and it looked good as long as you put a clear coat over it. I guess the clear coat helps seal the ink to the vinyl to last longer against the chemicals in the laundry detergent. I still think the hand on vinyl would be too much for someone that is expecting a similar feel as screen print. Ultimately, it comes down to the customer you are dealing with I guess.
What type of adhesive would you like to print on? Adhesive vinyl? Sure, several companies offer an printable vinyl that have heat applied adhesive on them. Now are you talking about printing from a dtg printer on to vinyl? Not sure why as the DTG inks are more expensive compared to standard pigment or dye base inks. However, I have talked to someone that has tried it on a "coated" (not sure what this means) vinyl and it looked good as long as you put a clear coat over it. I guess the clear coat helps seal the ink to the vinyl to last longer against the chemicals in the laundry detergent. I still think the hand on vinyl would be too much for someone that is expecting a similar feel as screen print. Ultimately, it comes down to the customer you are dealing with I guess.
sorry, I was talking about printing adhesive directly on to the shirt as you do with White ink. Then print the White ink on top of the adhesive. Is this type of thing possible ?
I dont know much about these machines thats why Im asking and curious to know.
I think properly applied screen printing ink will not crack after 50 washes. Some screen printed shirts will of course, but I have dozens of screen printed shirts that have been washed over 100 times with zero cracking.
I also have some that are cracked after the first wash (same with ink jet transfers and vinyl transfers). But I don't think it's the norm.
But I do get your point that a t-shirt design can realistically only be expected to last *so* long
Rodney, I think we are saying the same thing. If I am only willing to pay (or I like the word "invest") $10 dollars into something, I need to have the expectation that I am getting what I am willing to pay for. Some of the retail pricing is outrageous and I like to compare it to the retail pricing. I was told when I visited the Abercrombie & Fitch campus (that is what the call it), that they were going to sell a line of hand-painted t-shirts for around $150.00. That would be hard for me to pay no matter how awesome the design is.
I like to ask what the shirts are for. Are they going to be used for a promotion by a bank to be worn every Tuesday and Friday for 5 months? Is it a freebie that is going to given away for a beer promotion? For me, it is all about meeting (or preferablly exceeding) the expectation of the customer. If I know what the actually user of the garment or item is being used for or the target market, it helps determine what application is best for customer and the user (which many times can be different). You become more valuable to the customer if you are willing to ask the right questions to make sure that there needs are meet. JMHO.
Are you talking about pretreatment or is adhesive different? The current chemical formulations for pretreatment cannot be printed via an Epson (or modified Epson) print head. I believe DTG and possibly US Screen had this happen to them at tradeshows this past year and it clogged everything up. Not a pretty sight. The Kornit does spray down its pretreatment, but you are in a whole different price range (i.e. might want to move the decimal place to the right).
If you are talking about printing sometype of adhesive other than pretreatment, then I am not following you. Why would printing an adhesive (or glue) help with a dtg print compared to white ink?
DTG Kiosk, not another DTG question! 
