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DAGuide · June 11th, 2008

Since there seems to be a lot of questions of whether someone should decide to print white ink or not, I thought it would be best if we start a similar post as to what BobbieLee did with here - What DTG machine do you own and how did you make your decision on it :). The decision as to whether to print white ink or not in my opinion is really based on each individual company, the people running the printer and its target market / customers. One of the best ways to help with this decision is to find companies with similar characteristics and see what they did - whether successful or not. So below are two sets of questions that are pretty close to the same. One is for those dtg owners that currently or at one point or time printed using white ink. The other set of questions are for those never printed white ink. If you can answer the questions that apply to you, then prospective dtg owners can get a better feel for what would be best for their business when it comes to printing with or without white ink.

Anyone interested in doing this?

HERE ARE THE QUESTIONS:

White Ink Users
1. When you purchased your machine, did you plan on printing with white ink in the beginning? Please explain your thought process?
2. Did you immediately start off with white ink in your machine or did you wait a while?
3. How long (in days) and how many shirts approximately did it take for you to learn the process of printing white ink (including pretreatment)? What type of training did you have?
4. How hard is it to teach others in your business (i.e. employees, spouses,…) to run the printer and print white ink?
5. If you got a second machine, would you want it to print white ink as well or have a printed dedicated for light garments?
6. What is the best advice you would want to provide about prospective dtg buyers about your experiences in dtg printing?

Non-White Ink Users
1. Did you purchase a machine that has the capability of printing white ink or one that can’t print white ink based on its configuration?
2. If you have the capability of printing white ink, did you try at one point to print it and/or what keep you from using white ink?
3. Do you turn away customers for dark shirts, sell them on a light shirt done with a dtg printer or use an alternative decorating method (i.e. print-cut, plastisol transfers, screen printing,…) to do the job?
4. How hard is it to teach others in your business (i.e. employees, spouses,…) to run your printer?
5. If you decided to get a second printer, would you want it to print white ink as well or be a printed dedicated for light garments?
6. What is the best advice you would want to provide about prospective dtg buyers about your experiences in dtg printing?

martinwoods · June 11th, 2008

Non-White Ink Users
1. Did you purchase a machine that has the capability of printing white ink or one that can’t print white ink based on its configuration?

Does not have white in capability.

2. If you have the capability of printing white ink, did you try at one point to print it and/or what keep you from using white ink?

3. Do you turn away customers for dark shirts, sell them on a light shirt done with a dtg printer or use an alternative decorating method (i.e. print-cut, plastisol transfers, screen printing,…) to do the job?

I sell them on a lighter shirt than black or navy, if they have to have black or navy I screen them

4. How hard is it to teach others in your business (i.e. employees, spouses,…) to run your printer?

It is just me and my husband but you just hit the print button so not to difficult

5. If you decided to get a second printer, would you want it to print white ink as well or be a printed dedicated for light garments?

I would like to have a machine that prints white but would also like it to work as well as my brother and I have not talked to anyone that has one that will do that.

6. What is the best advice you would want to provide about prospective dtg buyers about your experiences in dtg printing?
I love the dtg printing, you can do a lot of things you cannot do with screens but I really can't give a lot of advice because I do not print white, but for light colored shirts it is the best thing. wouldn't trade mine for anything. Not sure how much help I have been but those are the best answers I can give.

nabs · June 11th, 2008

White Ink Users
1. When you purchased your machine, did you plan on printing with white ink in the beginning?

I'm a graphic artist and I knew that I wanted to be able to print white. I only looked at machines that had those capablities. I finally selected the DTG Kiosk II

2. Did you immediately start off with white ink in your machine or did you wait a while?

The machine already had white set-up with it because I purchased the demo machine from the show. I immediately started printing white. It took a few weeks of practice but I finally have the process down.

3. How long (in days) and how many shirts approximately did it take for you to learn the process of printing white ink (including pretreatment)? What type of training did you have?

Training would simply be reading, I did lots of it, online and the information that I also received from the company. It took approximately 30 shirts or so for me to really get the process down. I recently printed a photo of a white maltese dog on a black shirt. It came out terrific.

4. How hard is it to teach others in your business (i.e. employees, spouses,…) to run the printer and print white ink?

I don't think it's really difficult at all. You just have to show them a few tricks with the pre-treatment, printing..etc. I showed my husband how to do it and it was fairly an easy explanation. He picked it up very fast.

5. If you got a second machine, would you want it to print white ink as well or have a printed dedicated for light garments?

I would buy another machine that does white. I will never buy one that doesn't print white ink. Why would I limit myself in the printing process and what I was able to deliever to the customer.

6. What is the best advice you would want to provide about prospective dtg buyers about your experiences in dtg printing?

Don't be afraid of buying a machine that uses white ink. I also heard the horror stories but still purchased one. You must clean it each week, shake the white ink every few days and you shouldn't have problems. If you purchase a machine with white ink, give yourself some time (2-4 weeks) to learn the process of printing white ink. You need to be patient with yourself, don't give up.

Good luck,
Nabs

the funk · June 11th, 2008

Well, I am in the middle of becoming a white ink printer, so I will answer those questions.

White Ink Users
1. When you purchased your machine, did you plan on printing with white ink in the beginning? Please explain your thought process?

I purchased a machine that could print white, though I had no desire to print with white the day I received my machine. I wanted to learn my machine and experiment with it first. I also bought this machine to start my business, not add to an existing one like most, so I knew I would need some time before I could print white everyday. Also, I run a print shop, not a store, so I'm not on the strip.

2. Did you immediately start off with white ink in your machine or did you wait a while?

I waited until just recently to add white.

3. How long (in days) and how many shirts approximately did it take for you to learn the process of printing white ink (including pretreatment)? What type of training did you have?

Not to long, though I was having registration problems due to not having the current RIP upgrade, the one had had a bug. I still haven't messed with the white highlight feature, but I'm pretty sure it can't be that hard.

A couple of days with the pretreatment, only training was Dan's (from DTGinks.com) videos and his forum, as well as the Flexi forum and Kevin.

I have not done enough was tests to say if I'm happy or not with my pretreatment results.

4. How hard is it to teach others in your business (i.e. employees, spouses,…) to run the printer and print white ink?

Have not tried that yet!

5. If you got a second machine, would you want it to print white ink as well or have a printed dedicated for light garments?

One for lights, one for darks. Currently have a Flexi L, might pick up a used Flexi S for darks, maybe an HM1.

6. What is the best advice you would want to provide about prospective dtg buyers about your experiences in dtg printing?

Same old advise...solid business plan, maintenance, marketing.

To answer another question, since I'm not offering white yet, I try to never turn customers away. 4 color process plastisol transfers, traditional screen printing, vinyl, whatever they want.

joeshaul · June 11th, 2008

Non-White Ink Users
1. Did you purchase a machine that has the capability of printing white ink or one that can’t print white ink based on its configuration?
Our company purchased the Brother GT541. There are no plans for white ink with this model, however I hear people keep pressing Brother to do something about it.

2. If you have the capability of printing white ink, did you try at one point to print it and/or what keep you from using white ink?
My printer does not have that function, however I hear there is a learning curve involved with the ink, in addition to an extra treatment process, a lot of individuals have issues getting just the right amount of opacity/ink on the garment, and the ink has a higher tendency to clog the heads I've read.

3. Do you turn away customers for dark shirts, sell them on a light shirt done with a dtg printer or use an alternative decorating method (i.e. print-cut, plastisol transfers, screen printing,…) to do the job?
My target market is personalized items, so a majority of the time they want a photograph on a shirt, most photographs would look tacky on a black shirt anyways. I have had some companies request darker shirts, luckily I had the foresight to request sample rolls of garment vinyl to complement our Brother, so I haven't had to turn away business yet. Now I keep a few rolls of just plain cut solution garment vinyl, and a roll of printable garment vinyl in the event someone needs something other than solid colors.

4.How hard is it to teach others in your business (i.e. employees, spouses,…) to run your printer?
The machine is very easy to use, with graphics design probably being the hardest step in the process. I oftentimes design the job (using Corel X3), then let my mother handle the actual printing and pressing of it.

5. If you decided to get a second printer, would you want it to print white ink as well or be a printed dedicated for light garments?
I'd go with one that has white ink. I don't foresee any problems with my Brother, so it should handle lights for me for a few years.

6. What is the best advice you would want to provide about prospective dtg buyers about your experiences in dtg printing?
I originally went into DTG thinking "Wow, this is the future of the garment industry". I still believe it is, however the process is still slower than screening, and a bit more expensive. I primarily deal with short to medium size runs, never having come close to over 100 shirts from a customer.

I have faith in my product and even though inkjet transfers have come a long way, the number one thing I point out to my customers is "feel this shirt". So many are used to films and have a preconceived notion that they're going to be getting a product that is going to have issues being washed and a short lifespan. When I first started playing around with my vinyl plotter, I had some heat transfer vinyl that did the same thing, so I also adopted those notions. It wasn't until I found these forums that I decided to try some of the newer vinyls, which do hold up a lot better and they don't feel like I'm rubbing a leather sofa.

Always determine what your market will be before you make a purchase. We have a gift shop that we run in conjunction with our business. When folks are looking for gifts at our shop, it's easy to segue into the personalized items. I primarily wanted to focus on personalized items for people walking in the door, however our shop is still a bit slow and building up reputation/notice in town. In the meantime I've targeted local businesses with our services and had pretty good success as well. Doing sublimated mugs for floral shops, logo'ed shirts with employee names, etc. I'm debating heavily on whether to get a DBA and focus more on companies and instead of being personalized, changing my wording to "promotional" and market to some of the bigger cities. The DTG was kind of the topping on the cake for our personalization line, so I have no regrets about purchasing it. Now it's just a matter of getting them into the doors, or me going to beat down their doors

focusink · June 11th, 2008

Non-White Ink Users
1. Did you purchase a machine that has the capability of printing white ink or one that can’t print white ink based on its configuration?

Brother machine does NOT print white.

2. If you have the capability of printing white ink, did you try at one point to print it and/or what keep you from using white ink?

Cannot print with white ink.

3. Do you turn away customers for dark shirts, sell them on a light shirt done with a dtg printer or use an alternative decorating method (i.e. print-cut, plastisol transfers, screen printing,…) to do the job?

We so traditional screen printing with plastisol when we need white ink. I was not satisfied with the digital alternatives.

4. How hard is it to teach others in your business (i.e. employees, spouses,…) to run your printer?

Pretty easy. One of the shortest learning curves of any of my equipment.

5. If you decided to get a second printer, would you want it to print white ink as well or be a printed dedicated for light garments?

Absolutely, but not until I see one I like.

6. What is the best advice you would want to provide about prospective dtg buyers about your experiences in dtg printing?

Well, the Brother seems to have the best reviews, and it has lived up to them.

sunnydayz · June 11th, 2008

Ok Mark

Here are my answers:

White Ink Users
1. When you purchased your machine, did you plan on printing with white ink in the beginning? Please explain your thought process?

I absolutely looked for a machine that printed white. Not to say I didnt look at the brother and others that only printed color but I needed a full solution for my business, I did not want to limit my offerings to my customers. I considered the brother but quickly made up my mind to not go that direction, I quickly realized that not only could I not print white with it, but I couldnt get the detail I wanted or the color gradients. I liked the detail of the epson based print heads and versatility of being able to print what ever I wanted with no limits.

2. Did you immediately start off with white ink in your machine or did you wait a while?

Yes, I studied up everything I could find before hand and got to work learning once I got my machine. I dove right in

and dont regret it for a minute. I am pretty good at computers so I would say that if someone does not feel real confident in learning alot right away, then starting with color only might be a way to go.

3. How long (in days) and how many shirts approximately did it take for you to learn the process of printing white ink (including pretreatment)? What type of training did you have?

Pretreating I actually got right away with my first shirts. I would say a couple of weeks learning how to setup and tweak, and probably around 20 shirts (printed all over every one of them hehe

I waited till about 2 weeks to sell any of my products while I did wash tests and every thing else. I went to the full day training at swf plus really did thorough research before my purchase. So I was pretty prepared.

4. How hard is it to teach others in your business (i.e. employees, spouses,…) to run the printer and print white ink?

Well I havent really tried to teach anyone all aspects of it yet. My hubby knows how to pretreat correctly and he knows how the printer works, but he is pretty computer illiterate so he doesnt really understand the graphics program or the rip software too well. My daughter took to it right away as far as setting up her graphic and printing. She also is really good at pretreatment. I didnt really teach her as she has a good understanding of computers and the different graphics programs and such. She just watched me and knew what to do, kind of how I did it

5. If you got a second machine, would you want it to print white ink as well or have a printed dedicated for light garments?

I would definately buy another hm1 to add to the one I have. I would also have white ink as I would then be able to have double the production I have now. The maintenance is not a big deal, neither is the pretreatment. It really isnt so time consuming as people think.

6. What is the best advice you would want to provide about prospective dtg buyers about your experiences in dtg printing?

Research, research and more research. Make sure you are the kind of person that doesnt mind learning about everything to print well. If you are more the type of person who doesnt want to have to learn new programs and such then it is probably best to go the easy route with a machine like the brother, but If you go for the white know that your market has no limits and that is a decision only the individual buying the machine can make.

I see alot of people that buy the machines with white ink that do not fully understand the care that goes into it and then get upset because they are not open to learning the process. Dont expect to get your machine with white ink and sell garments the first day you get it or you will be sorely dissappointed. It takes time but its well worth the effort. Everything that is more complicated in life takes more time to learn and you should expect that but once you do its awesome

I would not change the route I went for anything, but I also made sure that the route I took fit my business plan perfectly.

JMclothing · June 11th, 2008

White Ink Users
1. When you purchased your machine, did you plan on printing with white ink in the beginning? Please explain your thought process? Yes, About 80% of my business is dark shirts so I was looking for a printer that could handle the demand (It has work out Great).
2. Did you immediately start off with white ink in your machine or did you wait a while? Jumped right in using the white ink- First order 350 Navy shirts full front...It was a great learning experience and it worked out great.
3. How long (in days) and how many shirts approximately did it take for you to learn the process of printing white ink (including pretreatment)? What type of training did you have? I would say about 2 days and about 30 shirts and no training
4. How hard is it to teach others in your business (i.e. employees, spouses,…) to run the printer and print white ink? These machines basically run them selfs once you now how to load the art work, but anyone who has used a ink jet printer can basically use them.
5. If you got a second machine, would you want it to print white ink as well or have a printed dedicated for light garments? If I was to get another printer it would have to have the white capabilities, maybe get a smaller machine.
6. What is the best advice you would want to provide about prospective dtg buyers about your experiences in dtg printing? Take good care of your printer and don't get discouraged give it some time trial and error.

Good luck to all future DTG printers its a great way to make some cash.

Gunslinger · June 11th, 2008

White Ink User
1. When you purchased your machine, did you plan on printing with white ink in the beginning? Please explain your thought process?

We purchased a T-Jet 3 in April 2007, specifically for it's ability to print all colors of garments. We already had an order from a local radio station for 200 black t-shirts with their logo on them.

2. Did you immediately start off with white ink in your machine or did you wait a while?

Immediately, the very first print was a full color 10x12 print on a dark shirt.

3. How long (in days) and how many shirts approximately did it take for you to learn the process of printing white ink (including pretreatment)? What type of training did you have?

Training via the included video tutorial, and it was fairly straight forward and simple. However, the process continued to evolve to find the right balance of underbase, and better techniques for pretreating shirts. We had a pretty good support group at the T-Jet forums, so a lot of users were sharing different ways to reduce the "box" left behind on pretreated shirts. We did get two bad batches of white ink, before dupont folks brought out the new white ink ... which is now amazing and very consistant.

4. How hard is it to teach others in your business (i.e. employees, spouses,…) to run the printer and print white ink?

I attempted to teach my wife the process, once, but she got bored with it.

But no, I don't think it would be difficult to train anyone on this.

5. If you got a second machine, would you want it to print white ink as well or have a printed dedicated for light garments?

Definately, another machine that also prints white ink. I am a firm believer in redunancy. If one machine breaks down for any kind of unforseen problem, I don't want to have to wait X numbers of hours or days or worse to fix the problem. I would only buy another machine that could the same, or better, than the existing one.

6. What is the best advice you would want to provide about prospective dtg buyers about your experiences in dtg printing?

Do your research, ask questions, get samples, go to the trade shows and watch every machine you can IN ACTION ... and take the training, if you aren't a DIY person. And determine your market, where Direct-to-Garment can really excel over the other printing methods. They are real money makers, if you do your homework, and the machines can pay for themselves within a year or two.

Mistewoods · June 11th, 2008

Non-White Ink Users
(for now)
1. Did you purchase a machine that has the capability of printing white ink or one that can’t print white ink based on its configuration?

We purchased the Flexi-jet definitely in part because of the white ink capabilities. We looked seriously at a Brother but rejected it on the basis of no white ink capabilities also we wanted the long and deeper print bed.

2. If you have the capability of printing white ink, did you try at one point to print it and/or what keep you from using white ink?

Our printer arrived with the R & H white ink and we used it. The pretreatment was no problem to learn. But it was simply not at all what was promised in terms of opacity. It was impractical and way over expensive to use due to multiple layers needed for opacity. I believe it was misprepresented in terms of being a useful alternative to titanium dioxide based inks- and we were told that the Flexi-jet would NEVER use DuPont ink. A few months later - when DuPont was offered by AA- we had re-structured our business model not to use white ink- and currently simply have almost no call for it, or we would use it. We have no fear of using it.

3. Do you turn away customers for dark shirts, sell them on a light shirt done with a dtg printer or use an alternative decorating method (i.e. print-cut, plastisol transfers, screen printing,…) to do the job?

We do use plastisol tranfers when we need white images. However most of our customers do not hesitate to choose light shirts instead of darks. Requests for darks are too infrequent to put white ink in our printer and add those maintenance routines to our day.

4. How hard is it to teach others in your business (i.e. employees, spouses,…) to run your printer?

Our teen children have run it without difficulty. I have easily helped lots of people to use these machines- people learn fast with adequate instruction.

5. If you decided to get a second printer, would you want it to print white ink as well or be a printed dedicated for light garments?

We would again choose based on the maximum flexibility- either white ink or even ecosolvent capabilities.

6. What is the best advice you would want to provide about prospective dtg buyers about your experiences in dtg printing?

Since there is still a lack of well trained tech support for many companies IMHO which sell garment printers as a general rule, I would suggest GO FOR IT ANYWAY! It is a bit more work than it needsto be to learn to repair your machine yourself and fine tune printing techniques BUT it is stilll really fun and profitable - I consider it worth the effort. Then take advantage of
t-shirtforums, inkjetgarmentprinters and dtginks.com to supplement your tech support and techniques with a great community of fellow owners. Just don't do it if you are not the type that enjoys a bit of a challenge.

zoom_monster · June 11th, 2008

White Ink Users
1. When you purchased your machine, did you plan on printing with white ink in the beginning? Please explain your thought process?
Very much so. I'd been waiting in the wings so to speak, to get a machine that was White ready. Even though I was ready, I had a fairly low expectation of quality, ease of use, etc. I knew that my experience as a screenprinter and digitizer would give me an edge and help me in this ground floor opportunity.

2. Did you immediately start off with white ink in your machine or did you wait a while?

Yes. A few days after I got my machine, after some experimentation, I pretreated and printed my first "dark" job. I mainly experimented my first month, weighing, timeing and tweaking my pricing strategy.

3. How long (in days) and how many shirts approximately did it take for you to learn the process of printing white ink (including pretreatment)? What type of training did you have?

My Better work that I sold to "non Friends" didn't happen for a month. I ruined several hunded dollars of shirts using too much pretreatment. Learning to treat pastels and non-black dark shirts was my biggest learning curve. Training... I got mine at the Factory and via experimentation.

4. How hard is it to teach others in your business (i.e. employees, spouses,…) to run the printer and print white ink?

Printing is easy. understanding what needs to happen to artwork, gamuts, color matching can be problematic. I guess some day I'll have to teach someone who works for lower wages than me...

5. If you got a second machine, would you want it to print white ink as well or have a printed dedicated for light garments?

I would get white capable, but might dedicate one or the other to dual CMYK. I like the redundancy of multiple machines.

6. What is the best advice you would want to provide about prospective dtg buyers about your experiences in dtg printing?

Buy local, or from a disributor that can hold your hand in the begining. Do research, and understand that your concept of how you expect it to be and how it "is".... is likely to change. Being from a graphics industry background, I had a low expectation of "DTG" printing, but I knew the value, and knew how to sell the strengths of what it is. In many ways, it was better than I expected.

focusink · June 11th, 2008

One of the reasons I did not purchase a white ink printer was the pretreatment required. I hate the way the shirt feels... as if it is a heat transfer. Does that wash out?
Also, the process seemed very cumbersome and time consuming.
I heard Brother is trying to develop an ink that does not require pretreating.

JPD · June 11th, 2008

Here are my replies:

1. Did you purchase a machine that has the capability of printing white ink or one that can’t print white ink based on its configuration?
Machine #1 - Yes (Flexi-Jet S)
Machine #2 - No (Brother GT-541)

2. If you have the capability of printing white ink, did you try at one point to print it and/or what keep you from using white ink?
We never tried white ink. At the time of our Flexi-jet purchase (12/06), we felt the formula of Dupont ink being offered was not up to par for our clients.
What kept us from using the white ink was the repeat clients who were sold on the brilliant results of the R&H inkset; so we did not want to change. Also, the time to pretreat and print dark shirts did not fall within our business model.

3. Do you turn away customers for dark shirts, sell them on a light shirt done with a dtg printer or use an alternative decorating method (i.e. print-cut, plastisol transfers, screen printing,…) to do the job?
We rarely turn them away, instead using vinyl (one/two colour or Versacamm printed) as an alternative. We also sub-out some screen-printing and will be trying plastisol transfers this quarter.

4. How hard is it to teach others in your business (i.e. employees, spouses,…) to run your printer?
There is a learning curve, but it is not difficult if you do your homework beforehand.

5. If you decided to get a second printer, would you want it to print white ink as well or be a printed dedicated for light garments?
If business increased dramatically and we had a call for a second machine, another dedicated light garment machine would most likely be our choice.

6. What is the best advice you would want to provide about prospective dtg buyers about your experiences in dtg printing?
When/if you purchase a machine, base your purchase on information you receive from actual users of the equipment/ink, or the reputation of the company selling the product. Both should be explored/investigated in order to make a knowledgeable decision.

Lastly, remember that many of the issues you will eventually have are user related, so take the time to learn your craft.

Eric

JPD · June 14th, 2008

I would love to see more replies to this. It is interesting to see how others came to their decisions.

Eric

Peta · June 15th, 2008

White Ink Users
1. When you purchased your machine, did you plan on printing with white ink in the beginning? Please explain your thought process?
Yes, our first T-jet2 was equipped with white ink from the beginning and we had decided to print on more than just white shirts.

2. Did you immediately start off with white ink in your machine or did you wait a while?
Started day one.

3. How long (in days) and how many shirts approximately did it take for you to learn the process of printing white ink (including pretreatment)? What type of training did you have?
We had absolutely no training and the printer was kind of a prototype with to thin tubes etc. so it took a while before we where satisfied. I would guess a couple of weeks and two garbage bins with shirts.

4. How hard is it to teach others in your business (i.e. employees, spouses,…) to run the printer and print white ink?
Nowdays it´s not hard at all. A couple of hours and they can manage by themself. After a day or two they don´t ask any questions and everything looks great.

5. If you got a second machine, would you want it to print white ink as well or have a printed dedicated for light garments?
We have more than 2 printers and all have white ink. I can´t see any reason why to have a non-white ink printer if you have learned the process right.

6. What is the best advice you would want to provide about prospective dtg buyers about your experiences in dtg printing?
Take your time to decide. Don´t rush into a new business and think that everything will work from day one. Go to faires, collect samples, explore your market etc. And don´t think that this method will compete with screen printed garment. DTG is made for less volumes, more colors and higher prices, make sure to get paid for you labor.

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