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Rizzo · February 16th, 2007

Don and mike, tks so mcuh for those points, but one particulart point is still not very clear to me, maybe I just want it in plain words........ how is the color to color comparison? for instance one color prints only..........
Red to red
Blue to blue
Green to Green..........

Does DTG give you the same bright colors as the image on the screen or slightly dull, maybe a shade? unlike the screen print...............what you see(mix) is what you get (the Print).

ohbrother · February 16th, 2007

Rizzo,

First let me say that I like screenprinting - the guys that do that are truly artisans and I have seen some amazing work from them. I use whichever technology makes sense for each project. Which looks better is purely subjective (PC vs Mac, Coke vs Pepsi, Taste Great, Less Filling...) and a religious discussion. This is probably a poor analogy, but does putting wallpaper over a porous wall look better than painting the same wall? Some people would say yes, as it yields a more uniform overlay. If I have a design that calls for a lot of a single color with a relatively low dpi image (72 dpi), I will consider that for screenprinting, or even cut a vinyl transfer. Since I'm in analogy mode, I have a color printer and a b/w laser in my office. When I want to print a b/w invoice I could print it on my color printer, but I don't. Why? The laser is designed for such a task and I don't want to tie up my color printer or waste the ink on that job. Likewise, I reserve my DTG printer for designs with lots of color and higher resolution (600dpi). The printer offers settings for vividness (0 -4) and ink volume (1-10). I normally operate it at vivid=1 and volume=7. If color was a problem I would set that puppy at the max (vivid=4 and volume=10), or even use its double print mode where it prints the design twice. The colors do look a little softer as they are part of the fabric and not laid on top of it, so you get a textured look. Again, some may not like this but others prefer it. Most of our designs have lots of color/detail to leverage the technology - that's why we get repeat business from customers who like our work. The paradigm is shifting, and we are trying our best to not do things 'the way they have always been done'.

As Mr Gump said, "that's all I have to say about that!"

Rizzo · February 16th, 2007

Thanks mike, That makes sense, the line that answered my question totally would be "The colors do look a little softer as they are part of the fabric and not laid on top of it, so you get a textured look. "

Move with the flow, yeah?

Don-SWF East · February 19th, 2007

Rizzo,

Sorry for the delay in responding, I was away at the ISS Show in Orlando.

To answer your question, no, the colors are not as "shiny" as plastisol, it is in essence melted plastic and will always be shiny, that is also what gives it such a heavy hand, which many people do not like. I do not advocate buying a direct to garment printer if you intend on trying to reproduce monotone or 2-3 spot color work in large volumes, let the screen printers do what they do best. I would, however, encourage you to offer those customers full color as an option (at a higher price) and let them make the decision. May customers request screen printing because they don't realize the full color is a viable option.

Hope this helps

Rizzo · February 19th, 2007

Tks Don, that surely helps. will get in touch with you if further clarifications are needed.

Vtec44 · February 19th, 2007

For us, we want to be able to do our own printing, but w/o letting the printing process dictates our imagination. Well, something like that

fasteddie · February 21st, 2007

has anyone done a quick comparison between heat transfers and direct to garment printing in terms of colors and cost wise ? thx !

Rizzo · February 22nd, 2007

regardless of the cost, as far as I can say.. heat press will always leave a white border when you use transfers, this probably is the major difference than the price as it is printed on a special paper and not directly on the garment like screen printing, this way ........ maybe the price factor is not truly comparable

tim3560 · February 22nd, 2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rizzo


	regardless of the cost, as far as I can say.. heat press will always leave a white border when you use transfers, this probably is the major difference than the price as it is printed on a special paper and not directly on the garment like screen printing, this way ........ maybe the price factor is not truly comparable

That doesn't really make since. If you use plastisol transfers there's no border. I am however beginning to see what you other pro dtg users are talking about as far as the print quality. How much time per shirt does it take to set up a shirt , print, press, and have a finished product? I would also love to see a cost comparison between using a plastisol transfer and the cost of set-up and ink on a dtg. I guess one main difference would be that you have no minimum on the dtg, but say we were doing an order of 20 shirts. The cost for the plastisol transfers would be $12.88 for 7 color transfers plus $1-2 for the shirts each. So for a 7 color shirt it's roughly $15 per shirt to print. What is the cost for a full color dtg for 20 shirts?

TahoeTomahawk · February 22nd, 2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by tim3560


	That doesn't really make since. If you use plastisol transfers there's no border. I am however beginning to see what you other pro dtg users are talking about as far as the print quality. How much time per shirt does it take to set up a shirt , print, press, and have a finished product? I would also love to see a cost comparison between using a plastisol transfer and the cost of set-up and ink on a dtg. I guess one main difference would be that you have no minimum on the dtg, but say we were doing an order of 20 shirts. The cost for the plastisol transfers would be $12.88 for 7 color transfers plus $1-2 for the shirts each. So for a 7 color shirt it's roughly $15 per shirt to print. What is the cost for a full color dtg for 20 shirts?

Depending on the image it could be $0.25 to $1 for the ink.
Also depending on the design it could take anywhere from 30 min to 1 hour or so to complete 20 shirts.

Another thing to consider is this:
If a customer calls and says they need 20 shirts by today could you do it?
How long does it take to order your plastisols before you can apply them as a transfer?
If printing your own plastisols, how long does it take you to do that?

One of the benifits of DTG is being able to print immediatly. We've printed several samples for customers within the first 15 minutes we've received their artwork in our email box.

Don't forget that your time is also money.

Rizzo · February 22nd, 2007

Sorry tim, I was not including Dye sub or plastisol transfers, my fault.

tim3560 · February 22nd, 2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rizzo


	Sorry tim, I was not including Dye sub or plastisol transfers, my fault.

No problem.

tim3560 · February 22nd, 2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by TahoeTomahawk


	Depending on the image it could be $0.25 to $1 for the ink. Also depending on the design it could take anywhere from 30 min to 1 hour or so to complete 20 shirts. Another thing to consider is this: If a customer calls and says they need 20 shirts by today could you do it? How long does it take to order your plastisols before you can apply them as a transfer? If printing your own plastisols, how long does it take you to do that? One of the benifits of DTG is being able to print immediatly. We've printed several samples for customers within the first 15 minutes we've received their artwork in our email box. Don't forget that your time is also money.

That's definitely a big point. Time is definitely money and I wouldn't be able to get my plastisols in a day, and only in 2 or 3 days if I paid a butt load of fees (around $100 or more)to get them rushed and overnighted. That's probably the biggest factor on my wanting a dtg is that I can do the shirts while customers wait. So a full color print would only cost $1 per shirt? That's a pretty big gap between $1 and $12 per shirt. I guess that's why they say that the machines pay for themselves so fast! When are the new and improved machines hitting the shelves this year? Does anyone know? I hear they're making improvements. Will the cost be the same then?

tim3560 · February 23rd, 2007

I also like the idea of taking the dtg to shows and printing custom shirts on site. I think customers at a car show would get a kick out of having their car and themselves on a shirt, and being able to get the shirt printed there at the show. Has anyone taken their dtg on the road? How does it handle while traveling?

OtakuClothing · March 6th, 2007

I have been doing some research into this. I have recieved sample shirts from the company (fast T-jet 2). I have gone to the local mall and had shirts made. My company does preprint designs. I thought, "WOW! Wouldn't it be great to print this guys full color designs with out the hassle of screen printing it." If you have been into screen printing you know what I mean about trying to do do process colors.

The DTG systems not the brand name DTG but all of them. Are mainly for people wanting to make tshirts but do not have the ability to print real shirts. It does a beautiful color. Can print on black. But everyone seems to fail to mention that the Fast T-jet has about 8 washes before it starts crackling. The prints on white start fading after about 10 washes. oh yeah you can wash the shirts 30 times but by then there is hardly a design left on a black shirt.

A good screen printer can do a quality white shirt with a good soft hand. Crappy people do not take the time and effort to do a good job. I have softhand shirts I printed 7 years ago that the shirts have holes in them and the print still looks good.

But I have to admit. When someone comes to me and says.... "Ummm hey I would like to get 6 shirts of this printed for a concert tomorrow." Yeah that is when I wish I dumped $15,000 into a printer. But then again. I am not in a mall kiosk. Heck I wish people would stop asking me to print shirts for them. I can hardly get my own printed.

So base it on what yu want to do. If you have a fistfull of $1,000 bills and want to start a business. The fast T-jet is for you.

What does it take to pay one of these bad puppies off. Lets say you spend $15,000 on one. To pay it off in 5 years you have to make $3000 a year in profit off the one machine (remember this is not including over head and stuff. This is solely pure profit from the machine being poured back into the machine.) so that means that everyday you have to make $8.43 in profit. So above cost of ink and the shirts $8.43 of pure profit. So you would have to sell like a shirt for $20 everyday for 5 years. And that is not making you a dime.

Thats cost comparison if you ask me.

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