[White Ink Printing on DTG Printers] CMYK inks wash of the white ink after 2 washes
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[White Ink Printing on DTG Printers] CMYK inks wash of the white ink after 2 washes
Re: CMYK inks wash of the white ink after 2 washes
Quote:
Originally Posted by wooftees
Hi Mark This is interesting. Does this mean that if you use the pretreatment for say pastel colours, that you could print say yellow on a light blue t-shirt, and the yellow would not be affected by the blue of the t-shirt. I have always put a white underbase on everything except white t-shirts. Also why do you need a pretreatment for white t-shirts when the print washes fine without it. Are you saying that these three different pretreatments are available for dupont ink?
I'm fairly new to all this, and finding there is a lot to learn.
Thanks Bridget
If you print without a white underbase on any color garment other than a white garment, the colors will be affected. The lighter the base color of the garment the less the printed colors are affected, but they are affected. A lot of people, myself included, are not bothered by the slight color difference when we print on a light yellow or light pink garment without an underbase. But we are talking very light colors of the garment base.
If you want as pure colors as you can get with your machine on any garment that is not white, you would use a white underbase. Depending the the garment color you are starting with, you would use one pretreament on light to medium color base garments, or the pretreament for dark color base garments.
You would also vary the strength of the underbase determined by the base color of the garment being used. I do not use quite as strong an underbase on a medium green garment as I do on a black garment for example.
The pretreatment for white garments adds just that little extra "pop" and vibrancy to the printed colors and is also supposed to keep the colors brighter longer.
I use all three pretreatments and as I said earlier, so far I have only ever used DuPont inks.
I only know the pretreament I use for dark garments is the original DuPont pretreament. I do not know if the other two types I use are actually made by DuPont, but I do get them from my suppliers that sell me the DuPont ink and original pretreament.
One thing to note: the original DuPont pretreament for dark garments is not good for any color garment other than really dark garments. It turns brown when exposed to direct sunlight but is not noticeable on a very dark garment.
Re: CMYK inks wash of the white ink after 2 washes
Quote:
Originally Posted by wooftees
Hi Mark This is interesting. Does this mean that if you use the pretreatment for say pastel colours, that you could print say yellow on a light blue t-shirt, and the yellow would not be affected by the blue of the t-shirt. I have always put a white underbase on everything except white t-shirts. Also why do you need a pretreatment for white t-shirts when the print washes fine without it. Are you saying that these three different pretreatments are available for dupont ink?
I'm fairly new to all this, and finding there is a lot to learn.
Thanks Bridget
Bottom line, the color of the garment is only half of the equation. The colors in the artwork are the other half you need to consider before you can determine whether you want to print white ink or not.
Re: CMYK inks wash of the white ink after 2 washes
Quote:
Originally Posted by bornover
Mark, is the polyester pretreat for sublimating cotton garments by putting a polyester substrate on top of the cotton for dye sublimation inks? Or does it work for water based pigment inks to? Or... I don't know, please explain it if it is none of these things.
The DTG pretreat fluid (www.dtgpretreat.com) designed for dtg printing on to polyester and blend garments is just for dtg printing. It is not the sublimation spray that allows users to print on non-coated products. You can use this pretreat fluid on cotton garments as well for extra pop (especially black ink) and better washability.
Never really tried to print sublimation ink or put traditional Epson OEM ink on top of this pretreat fluid. I serious doubt sublimation ink will work because it applies just enough chemical solids on the garment needed for dtg printing and have no clue how the pretreat fluid would react under the higher temperatures needed to turn the sublimation ink (solid state on the release paper) into a gas. I also would not expect the Epson OEM ink would work as well because it will not have the binders in the ink that dtg inks have. BUT... I will leave the door slightly open until someone runs the tests.
Re: CMYK inks wash of the white ink after 2 washes
Quote:
Originally Posted by DAGuide
The DTG pretreat fluid (www.dtgpretreat.com) designed for dtg printing on to polyester and blend garments is just for dtg printing. It is not the sublimation spray that allows users to print on non-coated products. You can use this pretreat fluid on cotton garments as well for extra pop (especially black ink) and better washability.
Never really tried to print sublimation ink or put traditional Epson OEM ink on top of this pretreat fluid. I serious doubt sublimation ink will work because it applies just enough chemical solids on the garment needed for dtg printing and have no clue how the pretreat fluid would react under the higher temperatures needed to turn the sublimation ink (solid state on the release paper) into a gas. I also would not expect the Epson OEM ink would work as well because it will not have the binders in the ink that dtg inks have. BUT... I will leave the door slightly open until someone runs the tests.
Hope this answers your questions.
Mark
If I understand right, the DTG Pretreat was developed to use Brother water based textile inks on Polyester and Poly/Cotton blend garments.
The website does not mention Epson based printers and DuPont inks. How does it fair on those?
The website also only mentions CMYK inks specifically. Good with white as well?
The reason I am asking is I am always looking for any improvement, or, lesser cost alternative of equal or better performance.
Re: CMYK inks wash of the white ink after 2 washes
Quote:
Originally Posted by bornover
That sounds like it should work. Do you have a way to measure the true temperature of the heat press? It is important, once, and I did not know it, my press had a problems and even though the temp gage said I had it at 167 C, it was not, it was more like 90 C, and my garments faded when washed.
Mine too, fellow who set the machine up and give me the demo said check temp with a laser heat gun but tech said no way check with a probe (mine was out about 50/60 degrees also)
Re: CMYK inks wash of the white ink after 2 washes
Quote:
Originally Posted by bornover
If I understand right, the DTG Pretreat was developed to use Brother water based textile inks on Polyester and Poly/Cotton blend garments.
The website does not mention Epson based printers and DuPont inks. How does it fair on those?
The website also only mentions CMYK inks specifically. Good with white as well?
The reason I am asking is I am always looking for any improvement, or, lesser cost alternative of equal or better performance.
Mark,
The research & development side of the pretreat fluid was done in conjunction with the help of the good people at Brother. They were one of the first ones to come out with a dtg printer and have lasted around with the same basic machine / ink that they started with. (Not many other companies can state that). That is why the information on the website all states Brother. However, the pretreat fluid works exactly the same on the Epson-based Dupont inks. There are distributors that are selling the pretreat fluid to Epson dtg owners. Maybe some of these people will post a comment if they see this thread.
In regards to white ink, no this pretreat fluid is not designed for it. We developing this pretreat fluid, we were focused on being able to print on 100% polyester. Since polyester is a very flexible, light fabric that wicks (removes moisture from the body) - we determined that the amount of ink (white & CMYK) typically used on a dark garment shirt would be too much to keep these desired characteristics of the polyester garments. So we created a pretreat fluid that drops significantly less amount of chemical solids on the garment after it is being cured. This means you will not feel the hand of the pretreat fluid on the garment after being cured like you do on the all white ink pretreat fluids. Since we have less chemical solids on the garment, we are not able to hold up the amount of white ink needed to block the color of the garment. So you cannot use just the DTG Pretreat fluid for printing on to dark garments. Thus, it is really designed for just CMYK dtg printing. Did I explain this okay? Some of this can get pretty technical (well above my head), but I like to keep things pretty simple.
Re: CMYK inks wash of the white ink after 2 washes
Quote:
Originally Posted by DAGuide
Mark,
The research & development side of the pretreat fluid was done in conjunction with the help of the good people at Brother. They were one of the first ones to come out with a dtg printer and have lasted around with the same basic machine / ink that they started with. (Not many other companies can state that). That is why the information on the website all states Brother. However, the pretreat fluid works exactly the same on the Epson-based Dupont inks. There are distributors that are selling the pretreat fluid to Epson dtg owners. Maybe some of these people will post a comment if they see this thread.
In regards to white ink, no this pretreat fluid is not designed for it. We developing this pretreat fluid, we were focused on being able to print on 100% polyester. Since polyester is a very flexible, light fabric that wicks (removes moisture from the body) - we determined that the amount of ink (white & CMYK) typically used on a dark garment shirt would be too much to keep these desired characteristics of the polyester garments. So we created a pretreat fluid that drops significantly less amount of chemical solids on the garment after it is being cured. This means you will not feel the hand of the pretreat fluid on the garment after being cured like you do on the all white ink pretreat fluids. Since we have less chemical solids on the garment, we are not able to hold up the amount of white ink needed to block the color of the garment. So you cannot use just the DTG Pretreat fluid for printing on to dark garments. Thus, it is really designed for just CMYK dtg printing. Did I explain this okay? Some of this can get pretty technical (well above my head), but I like to keep things pretty simple.
Hope I answered your questions.
Mark
Yeah Mark, that is exactly what I wanted to know. I might have to pick some up and test it out. Softball season is coming up and a few teams in my area have me make team shirts based on regular t-shirts to keep the cost down. An inexpensive wicking t-shirt that I could print on my T-Jet might be something they would like.
Re: CMYK inks wash of the white ink after 2 washes
Quote:
Originally Posted by wooftees
Hi I had this problem. I solved it by putting less pretreatment on the tshirt. Hope this helps. Bridget
Not sure how excessive pretreat will cause the colour to wash out, rather then the white underbase? Perhaps more pretreat = thicker white underbase = colours being removed from the top of the white underbase. hmmm
Re: CMYK inks wash of the white ink after 2 washes
Sorry for taking so long to follow up on this GREAT product (DTG Pretreat) BUT Dan has just about run out of any extra time, here are some pictiures on 50/50 and Poly and 100% cotton to show you my results.
First two pictures are on 50/50 using the SP product
The next two are on 50/50 without the SP produc:
I even printed on poly using white ink to show you that this is not accepable for this application:
On 100% Cotton No SP
and with SP:
__________________ www.DTGInks.com "Where help is always there, just for the asking"
Re: CMYK inks wash of the white ink after 2 washes
I wa replying to marks post!
Quote:
Re: CMYK inks wash of the white ink after 2 washes
Quote:Originally Posted by bornoverIf I understand right, the DTG Pretreat was developed to use Brother water based textile inks on Polyester and Poly/Cotton blend garments.
The website does not mention Epson based printers and DuPont inks. How does it fair on those?
The website also only mentions CMYK inks specifically. Good with white as well?
The reason I am asking is I am always looking for any improvement, or, lesser cost alternative of equal or better performance.Mark,
The research & development side of the pretreat fluid was done in conjunction with the help of the good people at Brother. They were one of the first ones to come out with a dtg printer and have lasted around with the same basic machine / ink that they started with. (Not many other companies can state that). That is why the information on the website all states Brother. However, the pretreat fluid works exactly the same on the Epson-based Dupont inks. There are distributors that are selling the pretreat fluid to Epson dtg owners. Maybe some of these people will post a comment if they see this thread.
In regards to white ink, no this pretreat fluid is not designed for it. We developing this pretreat fluid, we were focused on being able to print on 100% polyester. Since polyester is a very flexible, light fabric that wicks (removes moisture from the body) - we determined that the amount of ink (white & CMYK) typically used on a dark garment shirt would be too much to keep these desired characteristics of the polyester garments. So we created a pretreat fluid that drops significantly less amount of chemical solids on the garment after it is being cured. This means you will not feel the hand of the pretreat fluid on the garment after being cured like you do on the all white ink pretreat fluids. Since we have less chemical solids on the garment, we are not able to hold up the amount of white ink needed to block the color of the garment. So you cannot use just the DTG Pretreat fluid for printing on to dark garments. Thus, it is really designed for just CMYK dtg printing. Did I explain this okay? Some of this can get pretty technical (well above my head), but I like to keep things pretty simple.
Hope I answered your questions.
Mark
Dan "HAPPY PRINTING"
__________________ www.DTGInks.com "Where help is always there, just for the asking"
This is a discussion about CMYK inks wash of the white ink after 2 washes that was posted in the Direct to Garment (DTG) Inkjet Printing section of the forums.
Re: CMYK inks wash of the white ink after 2 washes 
