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mfaust · September 14th, 2009

I am asking for some general opinions-not legal advice. I have been designing fan tees since Oct of 08 for the series of books Twilight. I added hundreds of designs based on fan feedback before the movies were produced. I even tried to negotiate with the production company after the movies came out to design licensed merch for them with cast images--this did not happen--but they were fully aware at the time of my fan shirts from the books, in fact several of my original designs and slogans from the books were taken and used by them for the movies--i really could not fight that because I did not copyright my designs to begin with. I mean five different people who worked with the movie knew about my designs for over a year and never said there was a problem with what i was doing? Now over a year later they are saying I stole designs from them and that I need to shut down my fansite with the tees? I have never used copyrighted material from the movie- no cast images, logo, etc. I have only used themes from the books along with the first names of characters--how can you copyright a single name-or an entire theme like vampires? Am I crazy or does this seem entirely wrong?

sunnydayz · September 14th, 2009

It does not seem wrong to me. Usually with a movie or book they are protecting the whole artistic works. So if you are taking parts of those works, then it is my understanding that would be infringement. I of course am not an attorney and I can only say that your best bet is to contact an attorney for intellectual property, to see what your rights are, but I am pretty sure they would be with the production company.

red514 · September 14th, 2009

I feel for you. It does suck but i see this happening more and more. Fan sites for all sorts of things are getting shutdown. I've even seen video game fan sites getting there merch sections closed do to a legal warning from the license holder, even tho the merch did not contain any images from the game, simply general terms and lingo from the game.
I no little to nothing about copyright laws and find all these cases rather confusing. I've thought about it logically and can only come up with this concept. That the license holders do not want competition of any sort. What i think they don't understand is all this fan merch is actually helping them in the long run, promoting there merch even more (because they hold the license rights to produce the known images/logos/ect..) creating even more demand.
Bootlegging is one thing but fan merch that doesn't use copyright images ect... should be fine.. but it's not. :/

craigsanders22 · September 20th, 2009

They paid a ton to get the rights to the stories, characters, etc. Part of reason they paid so much was to make the movies. Another part was getting the rights to the merchandise. If you are selling products that use any of the copyrights that they paid for than then have the right to shut you down and take any profit you have made off of them.

It doesn't matter that your stuff was based on the books and was made before the movies. They bought out the rights, they now own them for both the books and movies and anything else.

You might be able to get away with some things if they are merely inspired by the franchise. If they don't use any of the intellectual property from the franchise you are OK. If you use any of their IP to promote your products though, even using the word Twilight, then you are probably going to get in trouble. Even if you don't, they can take you to court even if you are in the right. It's probably cheaper to just shut down unless you feel like hiring a lawyer and getting into a big mess.

hostingdiva · September 21st, 2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by craigsanders22


	You might be able to get away with some things if they are merely inspired by the franchise. If they don't use any of the intellectual property from the franchise you are OK. If you use any of their IP to promote your products though, even using the word Twilight, then you are probably going to get in trouble..

I actually do know a thing or two about copyright law (but I am not an attorney) and the above is spot on.

I am very sorry to hear that they did not tell you right off that there wasa problem. But, just because the people from the movie knew about your website and your products, does not mean that they okayed the use. The reason you see these fan fiction website up is because authors simple choose not to enforce their rights. But, they can change their mind at any time.

There was a recent case regaring the Harry Potter books that may clear things up a bit. Here is a link where you can learn more about the case:
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/16/ny.../16potter.html

Other sites that you will find helpful:
Legal issues with fan fiction - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (really great outline of the major issues)
FAQ about Fan Fiction -- Chilling Effects Clearinghouse
Fan Fiction Writers Face Nonfiction Legal Hurdles : NPR

In your post you said: in fact several of my original designs and slogans from the books were taken and used by them for the movies--i really could not fight that because I did not copyright my designs to begin with"

First, you don't have to copyright the works for them to be protected (but your damages are limited). Second, just because they knew about the works and have a license for the works from Twilight, does not mean that they can take your original work. So, while the licensees can stop you from making derivative works (which is what you did), they cannot approprirate those derivate works for themselves.

Also, you said that you had original designs and slogals - did you make these up based on inspiration from the book or did you get these slogans from the books? You can be inspired by all sorts of stuff - there is protection for those kinds of ideas because artists are inspired but all kinds of stuff. The question would be whether the works are derivative and whether someone who sees your work would have a reason to believe that your work is some how authorized by the license holders of Twilight.

You would need an attorney to really delve deeper into this but, honestly, if the situation is as you say, you should probably be compensated for the works they used that were your original creations. Moreover, I think by them using your work, there may be a solid argument for an implied license because them using your work certainly looks like they approved your designs and granted you a license of some sort.

If you have more questions, you can PM me.

Oh - they cannot copyright the theme of vampires but, depending on the context, Twilight might be protected.

PositiveDave · September 21st, 2009

Have you got the means to defend any action...?
Even if you are in the right?

AeresClothing · September 21st, 2009

"Twilight was released in theaters on November 21, 2008" According to Wikipedia. You started working on Twilight t-shirts a month prior to it's release which would have been WAY after they secured all the rights to the movie and merchandising and had already started marketing the movie.

You won't win this battle. Time to shut it down.

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